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Discussion Starter #1
This discussion was buried in another thread so I thougth I'd bring it out on it's own to try and get a definite answer. It was said in the other thread that the 10 is not "governed", and technicallyI'm sure it doesn't have a literal "governer" on it. I just know comin' from a busa that the manufacturers agreed to limit top speed on hyperbikes (busa and 12R at that time) to avoid govt intervention and much lower restricted speeds. To do this the manufacturers apparently retarded the timing maps in the higher gears to put the speed roof at 186.

My question is this... Does the 10 have a timing induced 186mph ceiling? In the other thread the answer was not clear and decisive. I find it odd that the 10 just happened to naturally top out at 186mph (which is listed as it's top speed in any specs I've seen in print). I also find it odd that Ivan would make a TRE (Timing Retard Eliminator) if the timing wasn't dumbed down. That's the main purpose of goin' with a TRE for the busa crowd. My understanding is that it lifts the busa's timing retard induced top speed ceiling by makin' the ECU think the bike is in fourth gear which does NOT get timing retard to limit speed. Some claim better throttle response too, but most I've seen post about it done it because it removes the top speed limitation.

I wanted to post this here so that maybe Ivan or someone who knows a definite answer to my question could comment. Is the 10 limited to 186mph via timing retard in the higher gears like the busa and 12. My guess is that it is, but I wanted to know for sure...
 

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Well, do you want real world or not???

I put my bike on the dyno and the speedo stopped at 186, but the bike kept going faster, trouble is (and hopefully you already know this) the speedos are not very accurate at that high of a speed. Looking at the dyno sheet it showed the top speed of 183 or so.

I think the speedo is off about 8-9 mph at that speed, so make your own judgements from that.

As far as anything else goes, don't know of any "timing retardation" or "speed limiting" devices installed on the 10.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Ivan said:
There is no limiter of any kind... at all :)

The TRE for the ZX10 is strictly for driveability....

Ivan :)
Thanks for all the replies... interesting!
 

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Just wondering is there a seedo diff. as i didnt ever see more then 299kmh and bike was still getin speed. But then someone mentioned that have saw 322 and 312 and so on. Im litle confused here.
 

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Ivan said:
There is no limiter of any kind... at all :)

The TRE for the ZX10 is strictly for driveability....

Ivan :)

To be clear what is the purpose of the TRE??

Are they hard to install?

And where do I get one and how much??
 

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96dragshee said:
I have radared my bike at 191 and there was probably another 1or2 mph left if I ran the bike out further.
191 mph and still more :headshake
Whoever radared your bike needs to get their inacurate gun calibrated.
The 04-05 zx 10 will go an actual 186 MPH on gps or radar
The Zx10 hits the limiter at the same rpm in every gear, it does not have a restriction like suzuki's early revlimiter in 6th gear.
The busa and gixxer do not use a 4th gear resistor its a 5th gear resistor.
 

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You can't compare a dyno top speed run with a real world top speed run. The dyno doesn't have any wind resistance, so it would be higher except for the rev limiter.
 

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a said:
Just wondering is there a seedo diff. as i didnt ever see more then 299kmh and bike was still getin speed. But then someone mentioned that have saw 322 and 312 and so on. Im litle confused here.
The agreement between the manufacturers for the European market is that speedometers would not display higher than 299 km/h and the actual top speed will not be more than that. Also the manufacturers had to stop using top speed as a selling point in advertisements. The ZX10R abides by this agreement. How it achieves that ... Apparently there is no explicit "hard limiter", but rather carefully organized ECU mapping so that this speed will not be exceeded on the road.

Dyno test (or rear wheel raised off the ground) isn't representative because the aerodynamic drag is not there.

European ECU has a different part number from the North American models. But even the American magazine tests don't give a top speed above 186 mph (300 km/h).
 

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GoFaster said:
The agreement between the manufacturers for the European market is that speedometers would not display higher than 299 km/h and the actual top speed will not be more than that. Also the manufacturers had to stop using top speed as a selling point in advertisements. The ZX10R abides by this agreement. How it achieves that ... Apparently there is no explicit "hard limiter", but rather carefully organized ECU mapping so that this speed will not be exceeded on the road.

Dyno test (or rear wheel raised off the ground) isn't representative because the aerodynamic drag is not there.

European ECU has a different part number from the North American models. But even the American magazine tests don't give a top speed above 186 mph (300 km/h).
So, GoFaster, you're saying this guy doesn't know what he's talking about? :rolleyes:

Ivan said:
There is no limiter of any kind... at all :)

The TRE for the ZX10 is strictly for driveability....

Ivan :)
__________________
www.ivansperformanceproducts.com
 

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For the person that asked where and how hard a TRE is to install, the person that posted the TRE answer IVAN is the person that make one of the best TRE's on the market and is one heck of a guy to talk to if you ahve TRE or PCIII questions.

I bought my TRE and PCIII last week and love it, bike runs soo much smoother now and has more power all over the place.

TRE is very simple to install, took me maybe 45mins to install both the TRE and the PCIII.

Look up IVAN Performance on yahoo and youwill find his site. Call him if you have any questions as he always takes the time to make sure people understand his products.

Now on the governor thing, like Ivan said there is no govenor per say but I could see the kawasaki corp making the mapping changes needed in the upper rpms that would limit the power output to where it would be harder to get to 186 or past it. I have a speedohealer on mine and so far it has only hit 178 on the corrected speed so far.
 

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sneaky said:
For the person that asked where and how hard a TRE is to install, the person that posted the TRE answer IVAN is the person that make one of the best TRE's on the market and is one heck of a guy to talk to if you ahve TRE or PCIII questions.

I bought my TRE and PCIII last week and love it, bike runs soo much smoother now and has more power all over the place.

TRE is very simple to install, took me maybe 45mins to install both the TRE and the PCIII.

Look up IVAN Performance on yahoo and youwill find his site. Call him if you have any questions as he always takes the time to make sure people understand his products.

Now on the governor thing, like Ivan said there is no govenor per say but I could see the kawasaki corp making the mapping changes needed in the upper rpms that would limit the power output to where it would be harder to get to 186 or past it. I have a speedohealer on mine and so far it has only hit 178 on the corrected speed so far.
:+1:

The throttle response was greatly improved on mine and other than the hell you have to go through learning to get the airbox out for the first time, it's an easy install.
 

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Andy said:
:+1:

The throttle response was greatly improved on mine and other than the hell you have to go through learning to get the airbox out for the first time, it's an easy install.
was the improved throttle response from the tre or pcIII????
 

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phastone said:
So, GoFaster, you're saying this guy doesn't know what he's talking about? :rolleyes:
The ZX10R conforms to the manufacturer's agreement to not produce anything with a top speed higher than 300 km/h. PERIOD. Every bike produced by all the Japanese manufacturers conforms.

As to HOW they achieved that ... I never said that Ivan was wrong. Perhaps there is no hard governor. But the bike does not have an actual top speed - on the road, not on the dyno - higher than 300 km/h. FULL STOP.
 
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