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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Help?:badteeth:

After 2000 miles from last valve adjustment, the timing got messed up. The old mark I made on the chain and cam sprocket was not align any more. When I tried to align the old mark on the chain and cam sprocket, the crankshaft marking points to 2,3 and not 1,4. What to do? How do I reset the timing? How do I tell which revolution of crankshaft mark 1,4 is the compression stroke and not the exhaust stroke?
 

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If I'm correct, you don't have to worry if you are on a compression or exhaust stroke, because there is a spark for each cycle on this bike... Don't take it for cash, but someone else here will probably confrm it.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
What I'd like to do is reset the timing and take compression test to see how bad it is.
 

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well if you stick a long thin screw driver down in the #1 or 4 cyl hole and turn the motor over by hand you will be able to find out if it is truely at TDC and then you can re-align the cams to your specs. did you degree the cams yourself?
 

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Discussion Starter #5
garth285 said:
well if you stick a long thin screw driver down in the #1 or 4 cyl hole and turn the motor over by hand you will be able to find out if it is truely at TDC and then you can re-align the cams to your specs. did you degree the cams yourself?
No I didn't degree the cams myself. I'm just a home mechanics. :)

Could you explain the stickin screw driver down the cycinder little more? Doesn't the crankshaft marking "1,4" give TDC for compression and exhaust? As I understand it there are 2 full rotations to complete the 4 strokes. One is the compression stroke. The other full toration will give exhaust stroke. I may just be misunderstanding things.
 

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Dude IF you're putting the cams back in on stock marks. Spin the motor up to TDC 1/4 it don't matter at this point because the cams aren't installed YET! Put the cams in and count pins. It's very simple if you read the book and take your time.

NONE! of the shit you're concerned about comes into play until the cams are installed...
 

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Discussion Starter #7
THanks! but that's what I'm trying to do, install the cams correctly. I'll be looking for that section on counting pins. In the mean time, how do you count pins? :)
 

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Just exactly like the shop manual says. The pins will always work out the same unless you change the head gasket to a different thickness. AND even then it's only a minor change in where they fall. VERY SLIGHT. This process is to difficult to explain without looking at the book and cams at the same time. It's simple to do if you really think about what's going on and do it exactly like the book says to the letter. Lay it down and walk away for now and read the book over and over again. You'll get it
 

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Discussion Starter #10
here isthe install section. I understand the mark alignment. IN to the left and EX to the right. The only question is what about the compression and exhaust stroke? If I remembered correctly, the EX is to the left when at compression stroke. :dontknow:

 

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nobody said:
here isthe install section. I understand the mark alignment. IN to the left and EX to the right. The only question is what about the compression and exhaust stroke? If I remembered correctly, the EX is to the left when at compression stroke. :dontknow:

If the ex mark is to the left your valves are bent.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
what are you talking about my valves are bent? ok somebody try this when you do your valve. First align the 1,4 mark at bottom. Then note where where the IN/EX mark on cam sprocket. Now turn crankshaft 1 full rotation, to 1,4 mark alingment. Note where the IN/EX mark again. I garantee you these marks would be opposite.
 

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Discussion Starter #14 (Edited)
ok nvm my last post.

Gunner, you're so right. It doesn't matter which stroke it is. it's which ever stroke it will be when you install it as long as the crankshaft is align.
 

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EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!!! I've been down this road for 25 years now.. Until the moment the cams are installed it's not an issue. There's nothing to be out of time there yet. It's only a rotating assembly spinning in circles. There's NO ignition timing to worry about because that is afixed to the end of the crankshaft.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
thanks gunner. i didn't realized waht you were saying before until i thought and bam it hit me. well i worked on it all day. i think im gonna be looking for new engine. :( the timing is reset but i didn't ahve the compression gauge ready so i put it all back together. the symptum is similar to before but little bit better. i can accelerate but still hesitate. it feels like the exhaust is plugged up. is there any history of the butterfly valve gone bad? i didn't have time to disabled it today. we'll see what happen tomorrow.

question: why is it that the engine can rev freely without load ands sounds normal but has symptum as described above when under load (riding)?
 

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Supercharged Mod
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I gather that the engine is back together, but we're missing some symptoms and a whole lot of the story ...

"The symptom is similar to before but little bit better" ... WHAT symptom?

What did you do to the bike that caused whatever the symptom is, and what is the WHOLE story on what has been done since? And what camshafts are there (are they stock, or are they race kit), and what are they degreed to, and what else has been done to the bike? Does it have a Power Commander, and if so, does it have an appropriate map in it? Is the exhaust butterfly valve connected properly and not backwards (cables reversed)? What coincided with the onset of the "symptom", whatever that symptom happens to be? Give us the WHOLE story.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
oh i thought i did. must be another thread. :)

Here is the lowdown. The bike is stock eveything. I did the valve adjustment 2000 miles ago. I mark the cam/chain and made sure to put back the way it was. The chain tensioner can only be installed one way. The bike ran fine up til last week. The symptom was all of a sudden the power just dropped when under acceleration. I had to limped home for few miles. I teared it down couple days ago. It appeared the timing mark wasn't the way I remembered putting it back together. The marks I made were pointing to the crankshaft marking 2,3 and were suppose to point to marking 1,4.

So I reset the timing according to the manual. I did't have the compression gauge to take the leak test. I just put it all back together. It rides little better but still hesitate under acceleration. I fear the valve and cylinder head are fucked up.

I never touch the butterfly valve. I took the pipe off and observe the valve. What it does is when the key is turned to ON, it will go from fully open to fully close then stop little bit opened. There is no sign of problem when idling and reving.
 

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Dude if your cams are in the stock holes they can't move!! EVER.....Also if you're marking the chain and expecting it to always fall right back at the same place for every rev you're sadly mistaken again. It will come back to that spot on the CHAIN at some time or another BUT NOT every revolution. Once the cams are installed it takes two complete revs of the crank to equal one rev of the cams. Study what's taking place with the valve cover off as you turn the motor over. I suggest a leak down test at this time.
 
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