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:headshake I knew those dumbfucks would ruin it. Nascar is the most boring, pitiful excuse for racing there is and the only reason it is successful is because there are a huge number of redneck retards in this country who can relate to the mostly redneck teams/drivers and they can cheer on the family sedan even though the "race cars" have nothing in common with them.

For the most part, sportbike riders/racers are different from the typical nascar fan and I don't want the racing we see determined by people who care about nothing but making money even if it means the racing suffers and/or becomes boring.
 

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looks like my fear of nascar are going to be true. no 1000 cc superbike. they havn't said yes or no, but why even think about it.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
:headshake I knew those dumbfucks would ruin it. Nascar is the most boring, pitiful excuse for racing there is and the only reason it is successful is because there are a huge number of redneck retards in this country who can relate to the mostly redneck teams/drivers and they can cheer on the family sedan even though the "race cars" have nothing in common with them.

For the most part, sportbike riders/racers are different from the typical nascar fan and I don't want the racing we see determined by people who care about nothing but making money even if it means the racing suffers and/or becomes boring.
I wanted to not think that but this news makes it very difficult.

I think the key is that the Nascar guys, according to Mel Harris want the emphasis put on the rider instead of the manufacture. But many of the fans get into motorcycle racing because the particular motorcycle that they have in their garage is represented on the track unlike Nascar's multi-million dollar machines that simply have shells put on them to make them look like a Taurus or Monte Carlo.

It's ironic that the Supersport and Superstock class most resembles what we, the common man can ride at our local track and that is the two classes they plan on eliminating.
 

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Next its going to be all the bikes are the same shape, same motor, same tires. That is gay- because motorcycles are sold based on their performance on the track, motorcycles are made better because of the race track, and people watch motorcycle racing because they want to see how the race version of their bike performs. If anything Moto Gp is rider over manufacturer more so than AMA.
 

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:headshake I knew those dumbfucks would ruin it. Nascar is the most boring, pitiful excuse for racing there is and the only reason it is successful is because there are a huge number of redneck retards in this country who can relate to the mostly redneck teams/drivers and they can cheer on the family sedan even though the "race cars" have nothing in common with them.

For the most part, sportbike riders/racers are different from the typical nascar fan and I don't want the racing we see determined by people who care about nothing but making money even if it means the racing suffers and/or becomes boring.
Being 49 years old I have been around the racing scene for quite a while. Back in the early 90's Roger Edmondson (one of your Nascar dumb fucks) created the AMA CCS series for profit. It was an incredible series. Then the AMA later tried to steal if from him and then fired him to steal his series.

Roger Edmondson while waiting for a trial for damages started his own series called the North American Superbike Series. He convinced the powers that be at 6 of the AMA's race events, such as Mid Ohio, Elkhart Lake and others to cancel the AMA events and goes with his.

It almost worked but the Jap big 4 got scared and decided to stay with the AMA after stating they were going to go with Edmondson's show.

So the North American Superbike Series almost happened but didn't.

Edmondson later prevailed in court against the AMA and was awarded millions in compensation for the AMA stealing his CCS series.

This Roger Edmondson guy isn't just some Nascar dumb fuck. He may be the most experienced in the country to operate a motorcycle race series.

I am going to give him a chance. I can assure you Roger Edmondson is no NASCAR guy dumbfuck, and he has the millions to prove it.

The first thing the AMA did when they announced the sale of the series promotions, were to apologize publicly to Roger Edmondson for what happened in the past. I bet he enjoyed that.

JJ
 

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^^^Lots of nascrap guys have millions of dollars. They're still dumbfucks and if they get their way AMA racing will be ruined also.

And I don't care how old you are, either. I'm 34 and I was into the "racing scene" in the early 90's also.
 

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^^^Lots of nascrap guys have millions of dollars. They're still dumbfucks and if they get their way AMA racing will be ruined also.

And I don't care how old you are, either. I'm 34 and I was into the "racing scene" in the early 90's also.
You missed the point entirely. Roger Edmondson is not a Nascar dumbfuck and that was the purpose of the post. Most people would have little knowledge of Roger Edmondson's history. I am old enough to have been around back then.

You would have been what then, 16?

JJ
 

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:headshake I knew those dumbfucks would ruin it. Nascar is the most boring, pitiful excuse for racing there is and the only reason it is successful is because there are a huge number of redneck retards in this country who can relate to the mostly redneck teams/drivers and they can cheer on the family sedan even though the "race cars" have nothing in common with them.

For the most part, sportbike riders/racers are different from the typical nascar fan and I don't want the racing we see determined by people who care about nothing but making money even if it means the racing suffers and/or becomes boring.

The Matt and Ben show isn't boring? I think so. We have boredom now in the series. Sales are higher for 600cc so why not have a 600 Superbike?
 

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^^because a 600 is not a superbike its a supersport, the progression from the lower cc to the liter bikes is what makes it great. look at every other kind of racing series in the world it works for them without fault. Ok i will say the ben and matt show is old but let the season mature and let the younger guys show what they can learn. the idea of a "standardized" race is boring and it shows a lack of imagination on the parts of all the heads of the AMA.
 

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Hmm. Interesting read. I don't like NASCAR at all. BORING. But at the same time, the Superbike races are kind of boring. After 3 or 4 laps, it is just Matt and Ben. At least lately.... I'd like to see closer racing more like the Supersport classes. Seems like the closer to stock, the closer the racing. Maybe they should wait and see how the 2009 rules work before trying to "fix" things.

Myself, I'd like to see Supersport versions of both 600cc and 1000cc. I'll let someone else decide if there is going to be a sliding displacement scale based on wether it is a twin, tripple, etc... And then make the Superbike class 750cc. Again, maybe allow more displacement for different configuations. But 1000cc twins are too much of an advantage.

Just my :2cents:


Chris
 

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"I felt that at three of the four companies their management people should be proud of the professionals running their race department. Obviously, that does not mean that they agreed with everything that we said. It means that we had a good, solid exchange of views that can only lead to better understanding of each others positions. Three of them made an effort to give us advice and where appropriate share concerns. And one didn't. One simply ... went off. Behavior of one of the four was, in my opinion, shameful."

And how much do ya'll wanna bet that was the whiney little cheating bitches at Suzuki who have had the AMA in their back pocket for the last 5 or more years?! Maybe it's best that SOMEONE step in and level out the playing field preventing one company in particular from cheating. Anyone remember the whole traction control fiasco?! Traction control is illegal............WOW Suzuki is using traction control...............Let's make it legal! What a bunch of fucking bullshit. The AMA is sad and pathetic and in need of an overhaul. Bring on the changes.
 

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"I felt that at three of the four companies their management people should be proud of the professionals running their race department. Obviously, that does not mean that they agreed with everything that we said. It means that we had a good, solid exchange of views that can only lead to better understanding of each others positions. Three of them made an effort to give us advice and where appropriate share concerns. And one didn't. One simply ... went off. Behavior of one of the four was, in my opinion, shameful."

And how much do ya'll wanna bet that was the whiney little cheating bitches at Suzuki who have had the AMA in their back pocket for the last 5 or more years?! Maybe it's best that SOMEONE step in and level out the playing field preventing one company in particular from cheating. Anyone remember the whole traction control fiasco?! Traction control is illegal............WOW Suzuki is using traction control...............Let's make it legal! What a bunch of fucking bullshit. The AMA is sad and pathetic and in need of an overhaul. Bring on the changes.
:+1::+1::+1::+1::+1:
 

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That "something" needed to change is not in question.

That "this" is the way to change it ... makes no sense whatsoever to me.

I find it interesting that Roger Edmondston would want to go down this road. I find it interesting that Colin Fraser, who has run the Canadian Superbike championship for the last few years, has not had something to say about it. Or maybe they have, but their voices were overruled by the Nascar crowd who thinks what worked for Nascar would work for motorcycles.

The direction that Canadian Superbike has gone (and from what I understand it, British and Australian series as well) has been towards horsepower-and-weight-based classes for the 600 and Open classes with limited modifications, with an additional class for something like the Moto ST, and an additional amateur 600 class, and one or two other support classes. Our superbike class is like the AMA's outgoing Superstock but with max horsepower and min weight limits. And the last couple years has been with spec tires (Pirelli).

The production-based bikes here were a reaction to reduce costs, and I'm sure this pressure exists in the USA also. So why adopt a 600 Superbike formula instead of production based classes?

I gather that they want to make the riders the central show, and that's fine, but you don't jump there in one shot and alienate those who have supported you for decades.

I can understand a long-term rationale for wanting to phase out the 1000cc bikes - they're too fast and too hard on tires, and to be honest with the drop to 800cc by MotoGP and pressure from safetycrats and bureaucrats and insurance companies against having such fast bikes on the street - but again, jumping straight there in one shot with next to no advance notice makes no sense.

I wonder what happens to riders who are already under contract through 2009 for classes that might no longer exist.
 

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JimmyJam said:
Most people would have little knowledge of Roger Edmondson's history. I am old enough to have been around back then.

You would have been what then, 16?

JJ
And your point is? What does being 16 have to do with racing knowledge? I started riding before 6 and I was following roadracing in the late 80's when Lawson was kicking butt and taking names.

P 51 Jockey said:
Sales are higher for 600cc so why not have a 600 Superbike?
Because they are 600s. They should be a "beginners" class that factory riders shouldn't be allowed in. Sales are higher for 600s because its what more people can afford to buy and insure. Not because they are exciting.

And everyone whining about the Matt and Ben show and suzuki wanting 1000cc bikes needs to get over it and the other manufacturers and riders need to step up if they don't like it. I'm sure almighty honda and the almost as huge yamaha have the funds to make better bikes and/or figure out TC. And kawi and suzuki are about the same size. If suzuki can do it, kawi should be able to also. Besides, superbikeplanet said that 3 out of 4 companies wanted the big bikes as the premier class. Not just suzuki.
 

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That "something" needed to change is not in question.

That "this" is the way to change it ... makes no sense whatsoever to me.

I find it interesting that Roger Edmondston would want to go down this road. I find it interesting that Colin Fraser, who has run the Canadian Superbike championship for the last few years, has not had something to say about it. Or maybe they have, but their voices were overruled by the Nascar crowd who thinks what worked for Nascar would work for motorcycles.

The direction that Canadian Superbike has gone (and from what I understand it, British and Australian series as well) has been towards horsepower-and-weight-based classes for the 600 and Open classes with limited modifications, with an additional class for something like the Moto ST, and an additional amateur 600 class, and one or two other support classes. Our superbike class is like the AMA's outgoing Superstock but with max horsepower and min weight limits. And the last couple years has been with spec tires (Pirelli).

The production-based bikes here were a reaction to reduce costs, and I'm sure this pressure exists in the USA also. So why adopt a 600 Superbike formula instead of production based classes?

I gather that they want to make the riders the central show, and that's fine, but you don't jump there in one shot and alienate those who have supported you for decades.

I can understand a long-term rationale for wanting to phase out the 1000cc bikes - they're too fast and too hard on tires, and to be honest with the drop to 800cc by MotoGP and pressure from safetycrats and bureaucrats and insurance companies against having such fast bikes on the street - but again, jumping straight there in one shot with next to no advance notice makes no sense.

I wonder what happens to riders who are already under contract through 2009 for classes that might no longer exist.
From what I gathered Roger Edmondston has just drafted a proposal and is still gathering input from the big four to "tweak" the final product which is why he is visiting them in the first place. It's the obvious politics from Suzuki wanting to throw their weight around and have shit go "their way" that should scare folks. I don't think everyone should panic just yet in terms of what the classes will be like. I'm sure if this guy has the background he has and the wits some on here say he does, he will look at ALL possibilities to make this thing float. The AMA sure as hell hasn't done what they needed to do so why not open it up to new ideas. Don't tell me you've ENJOYED the Matt and Ben show the last two years and the Matt show the previous 5! The only class that has stayed competitive is the Supersport class and if they're going to make it the premier class based on competition that's a good start. Just my .02
 

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Man, I hope we aren't starting down a slippery slope. Moto gp scales down to 800cc's, AMA eliminates the superbikes, what's next? No more World Superbike, then what, the manufacturers don't even build the 1000's any more. I really hate to think about the AMA racers riding something that would be the equivelant of NASCARS "car of tommorrow". The Mladin/Spies show will end only when the other manufacturers decide to pour some $'s and effort into it. Anyway my :2cents:
 
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