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You guys may know that the surging idle issue these bikes have drove me crazy. It all started after removing the cats and installing an aftermarket high flow exhaust. So today I put the factory muffler back on with a cat delete link pipe. Would you believe that fixed the idle problem?! These bikes like some back pressure down low in order to keep their composure. Apparently a little constriction is a good thing. My graves exhaust has a huge outlet opening and it just loosened the idle up. So I’m super happy about that. Thought I had an exhaust leak. Tuning doesn’t help back pressure issues. The only downside is that the bike is quiet AF and I worry that cars won’t hear me.

Also the link pipe I am using has a bung for a wide band sensor which puts the sensor super close to the collector. Now the autotune readings seem to be more accurate fingers crossed.My graves exhaust had the bung too far back and after a bend so it wasn’t ideal plus there was some exhaust reversion going on because of the huge opening which was throwing off the readings. Anyway just wanted to let you guys know


So now I have a crazy question. Which aftermarket exhaust provides some back pressure ??!! Bet no one ever asked that question!
 

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Some of the pipes have silencer plugs in them. That would be what u are after. Really strange though cause my bike doesn't surge and I have no cat and a super short exhaust with a huge hole. I mean super short. If I moved over and took a photo directly from the side of the bike the pipe doesn't even come out as far as the rim
445196
 

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Yeah I like how your bike idles I really don’t know why that seems like the fix for my bike but I’m glad I found out. I should have mentioned that I have it idling now at 1200 not 1500 anymore and it goes up and down maybe 100 sometimes but totally normal.
Also the idle issue I’m talking about only happened at certain times like after a warm start. So if I rode the bike warmed it up then turned it off for a few minutes and restarted it without moving the bike it would surge. Ima picky fuck
 

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Discussion Starter #5
It could be also the size of the muffler that made the difference. My graves is pretty much straight With little muffling. I don’t know
 

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Yeah I'm not so sure about my tuning skills. The last map I hand made was so damn rich my bike wouldn't run without keeping the throttle partially open even after trying to raise the idle up to 1500 rpm lol. Had to flash back a stock map and then a modded one again to get her running properly. So yesterday I flashed a total of 7 times all said and done lol. But idk. I wonder if I can remove a map I tossed up on map share or otherwise edit it so it isn't so ehhh lol. Damn thing would only work with a turbo or super charger installed lol.
 

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Dude that pipe isn't even kinda short like in any way at all...no way you were getting reversion with that pipe. When it is off the bike you can see straight through it right? I mean, my pipe has a larger diameter than the collection area, it's pretty large and yeah idk. In the end, all these pipes are just fucking glass packs. People saying x y or z is better lol but they are all super cheap old school tech glass packs. Length and diameter is about all they can change and the way the holes are angled or how many or what size they are etc inside the pipe. Long better for low rpm short better for high revs. But that graves is definitely not short
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Yeah the only other thing I can think of is that where the wide band sensor is is too far back and it’s after the bend which isn’t ideal. Also I don’t know why the bike would surge with that pipe on. I mean she idles like 90 percent better with just a little normal rpm rpm jumps + or - 150. The idle used to dip under 1000 at times with that exhaust when it was set to 1100 or 1200. Like it was going to stall. Idk
 

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That is strange. Did u take out the ram air flap? Block off plates? Disable stick o2 sensor ? Change to a race air filter or at least a high flow / k&n filter
 

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Discussion Starter #14
I did all of the above. I had the ram air set to stay open. I actually put the pair valve back in and stock air filter and connected my o2 sensor just to see if she would idle better with the graves exhaust and still it surged until I put the stock muffler back on 🤷🏻
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Yeah it is. I’ve seen other bikes idle fine without any back pressure but I also know idle surge is super common with these bikes and everyone says to just accept it or deal with it or get used to it. But it’s unacceptable to me. Unless the 2019 2020 bikes are more finicky I don’t know. Seems like they May be
 

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My idle has been at 1350 for 7 years on a Gen 4. I did this because the idle is smoother and oil pressure is a little higher. Something to consider if you run the piss out of your bike and then come to an idle and let it sit.

Bump up your idle ( I wish I had this choice with my new GSXR doing the exact same thing, known problem with full exhaust, afr adjustments can make it better, but not cure it. Raising idle rpm would)
log and find the cells in the iap map you are in. Add fuel there and try it
look at the ignition map while at idle, see if it is flat or steady. A slightly higher number in the lower rpm is by design it gives a torque increase to boost idle rpm, look at the surrounding cells and see if you;re hitting those cells.

Essentially you want to minimize changes in torque input, fluctuating afr and timing changes torque.

Good luck.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
My idle has been at 1350 for 7 years on a Gen 4. I did this because the idle is smoother and oil pressure is a little higher. Something to consider if you run the piss out of your bike and then come to an idle and let it sit.

Bump up your idle ( I wish I had this choice with my new GSXR doing the exact same thing, known problem with full exhaust, afr adjustments can make it better, but not cure it. Raising idle rpm would)
log and find the cells in the iap map you are in. Add fuel there and try it
look at the ignition map while at idle, see if it is flat or steady. A slightly higher number in the lower rpm is by design it gives a torque increase to boost idle rpm, look at the surrounding cells and see if you;re hitting those cells.

Essentially you want to minimize changes in torque input, fluctuating afr and timing changes torque.

Good luck.
Thank you ! Yeah w the graves exhaust I had my idle at 1500 just to get it to idle perfectly. Now w stock muffler she idles at 1200. 1500 seemed too high but bumping up the idle def helped a lot. And yeah I can watch the autotune live in my bike and see where the idle lives in the map. Seems like the autotune has smoothed the bike out including idle. Fingers crossed lol
 

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I don't think it's a year specific thing. I have a 2016 with a Yoshimura Alpha (one of the longer pipes also for this bike) and mine does the exact same thing. I've played with the idle just to see and anything under 1500 it always like to do the idle hunt. Recently I did a mapshare that came from a bike with the same issue and had timing/iap adjusted in the lower rpms and it got much better but still was there slightly. Waiting for block off plates and the SC Project exhaust to come in now and will see if that makes any difference. I think it's ECU specific rather then year. I think that some of the ECU's just don't like losing the cat. It's also possible that its a Cali bike thing. Is your bike a Cali model?
 
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You guys may know that the surging idle issue these bikes have drove me crazy. It all started after removing the cats and installing an aftermarket high flow exhaust. So today I put the factory muffler back on with a cat delete link pipe. Would you believe that fixed the idle problem?! These bikes like some back pressure down low in order to keep their composure. Apparently a little constriction is a good thing. My graves exhaust has a huge outlet opening and it just loosened the idle up. So I’m super happy about that. Thought I had an exhaust leak. Tuning doesn’t help back pressure issues. The only downside is that the bike is quiet AF and I worry that cars won’t hear me.

Also the link pipe I am using has a bung for a wide band sensor which puts the sensor super close to the collector. Now the autotune readings seem to be more accurate fingers crossed.My graves exhaust had the bung too far back and after a bend so it wasn’t ideal plus there was some exhaust reversion going on because of the huge opening which was throwing off the readings. Anyway just wanted to let you guys know


So now I have a crazy question. Which aftermarket exhaust provides some back pressure ??!! Bet no one ever asked that question!
Hello,

I had my las accident because I assumed ppl cold hear me with my loud exhaust and there is always some retard that doesn't care or can't hear.

So I would recommend you don't make the same mistake I did. Always assume ppl can't see or hear you.

-Cheers
 
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