[Wrangoleer]

WSBK and BSB. How close to stock are they really? I know they don't run lights and such but compared to a "stock" bike, the ones we ride every day, just how close are they? Do they go inside and do things like change cams and such or are they tied to a stock block and head? I know they change up the wheels, brakes and at least tweak or change suspension but is that it? I know there will always be that gap between the race track and the show room floor but I've noticed over the last 20 yrs. or so that gap has closed some. For me, it's sometimes difficult to convince myself that I'm not riding a race bike around when I'm out on my 10R.
:zx_red:

 

[rcannon]

The look similar to a stock bike, and thats about it.

Although based on the bike we have access to, theres pretty much not one part on it that is not modified. Theres a real effort put into making it appear stock, but its nowhere close. Fork internals, brake calipers, swingarm, wheels, plastic, seat , fuel tank..all different.

Its to to say the stock bike is bad. This is at the highest level of competition and everyone wants to be the best.

Look at the frame, near the front sprocket. You can see how much work was put into just that.

Back in 2013, wsbk tried to limit the price of the bike to 250,000 euros. That lets us know factories are spending more than that to field a top end machine. Thats about the same as $265,000 american dollars. Similar to stock? Not really.

 

[obijack]

No idea. But there is the info if you care to read it. All i know is they are not prototypes like motogp. They are actual production bikes.

WorldSBK < Glossary

Regulations and documents: FIM Website

 

[rcannon]

Sorry..meant to say, "Not that the stock bike is bad....."

 

[obijack]

https://lincolnshirebiker.wordpress.com/2015/11/01/wsbk-successful-debut-test-for-2016-zx-10r/
https://lincolnshirebiker.files.wordpress.com/2015/11/hi_t1_sykes_zx-10rdsc_0230.jpg

 

[Wrangoleer]

Thanks for the links guys. $265,000! Wow!

 

[ukzx10r]

They are very far from stock. Even frames are modified.
bsb have some rules that meant kawasaki wasnt able to get full potential out of the bikes this year engine wise but they have sorted that by making the 2017 zx10 rr as that has the engine modifications as standard that will allow mss to get the bikes to world superbike spec in 2017

 

[rcannon]

The thing is, we are probably lucky in that its not the full spec bike. To take advantage of the extra performance, we would need tires that lasted, what, maybe 45 minutes?

I know maintenance specs on the current 250f dirt bikes call for a full and complete rebuild every 20 hours, or less. You have to figure a wsbk engine to be similar, if not more so.

Plus, I doubt its really THAT much better unless a world class rider is on the machine. If you gave me Rea's zx10, I dont quite see myself in the top 10....top 15, for sure......yea, in my dreams.

 

[rcannon]

Soem years back, the magazine "Motorcycle sport and Leisure" had an article talking about a new gsxr 1000 build.

Their dollar figure, to make the bike capable of a lap time 1 second faster, was $14,100.

 

[dricked]

Soem years back, the magazine "Motorcycle sport and Leisure" had an article talking about a new gsxr 1000 build.

Their dollar figure, to make the bike capable of a lap time 1 second faster, was $14,100.

That is not true. Stock bikes are good but not anywhere near a decent race bike which would cost in the nighbourhood of $15k to build. Throw on some suspension and a set of slicks and you're more than 1s faster. It would depend on the test rider too. If you can't push the limits of a stock bike there's not much point in dumping money into it.

A WSBK bike is so far removed from what you get off the showroom it's not even comparable.

 

[rcannon]

You saw the article in the august 2013 issue?

You understood the context was when they mentioned the dollar figure?

They had already done the obvious things like light removal, mirror removal, and adding slicks? I'm sure they went out of their way to lie about the cost (????), but there is a price list.

The figure was talking about he cost of building a WINNING bsb bike, or one capable of wining the isle of Man TT. Not one capable of entering, but one capable of winning. , nothing to do with me. I just bought the magazine, and saw the article.

I was wrong on the dollar figure. The 14,100 figure they gave was in British pounds. Back then, it would have been closer to 25,000 american dollars.

 

[ukzx10r]

Simply put a wsb or bsb is basically a completely custom made race bike which resembles the stock bike.
The components that they share is minimal.
They have to start with a stock frame but thats modified. Engine cases as far as im aware are not allowed to be modified for bsb.
Everything else is chucked away.
Im trying to think of another component that is kept but i cant think of one. Maybe they have to use a standard crank? Or at least modify the standard crank.
But all the components can be purchased so theoretically you could make one yourself.
But whats the point when you can buy one from this years bsb for £30000 off ebay

 

[dricked]

You saw the article in the august 2013 issue?

You understood the context was when they mentioned the dollar figure?

They had already done the obvious things like light removal, mirror removal, and adding slicks? I'm sure they went out of their way to lie about the cost (????), but there is a price list.

The figure was talking about he cost of building a WINNING bsb bike, or one capable of wining the isle of Man TT. Not one capable of entering, but one capable of winning. , nothing to do with me. I just bought the magazine, and saw the article.

I was wrong on the dollar figure. The 14,100 figure they gave was in British pounds. Back then, it would have been closer to 25,000 american dollars.

Well no I didn't read the article, I just read your post saying that it costs $14k to lnocl a second off the times a gsxr would turn. Sorry.

It makes sense when you explain it in detail.

 

[Carlos76]

I think intresting question would be this:

How many seconds per lap Rea or BSB boys would lose on a ZX10R bike built with best aftermarket parts you can buy freely?
Parts like some GP4-RR breaks, Kawa kit motor parts, Ohlins tuned TTX25 carts etc.
Part worth somwhere 20k total pluss good headwork and tuning.

I would guess only 2 to 3 seconds on circuit with no long straights.

 

[GoFaster]

At that level, 2 or 3 seconds a lap is a looooong time!

"ya gotta do what ya gotta do"

 

[turtle1000]

At that level, 2 or 3 seconds a lap is a looooong time!

"ya gotta do what ya gotta do"

Yeah considering most wsbk races top 5-10 are barely separated by that...

 

[obijack]

Rea was faster on his wsbk at a circuit recently than several of the Motogp bikes that day. I think wsbk kawi makes around 220whp. Can anyone provide insight to hp for wsbk? I think motogp is 260? Not sure.

 

[Carlos76]

Yeah considering most wsbk races top 5-10 are barely separated by that...

Reason for finishing close together is race strategy and planning resources etc. If you look at best lap or qualifing times then differences are there, BIG differences between 3rd and 20th.

 

[rcannon]

Ive dug into this a little bit, and looked for the "dollar value" of one of the top wsbk machines.

That resolution looks like it did pass, in 2013. So, it looks like no more than 250000.00 euros can be spent.

But, its hard to say how much of the money is the bike, itself. If I have 60,000 of wind tunnel work done, does that count as the bike, or is it of the record?

It does kind of prove something when you go to a regular race track. Locally, an r1 yamaha is a match for anything. On tv, you only wee the r1 when the Kawasaki laps it.

I got up pretty close to Ryan Villopotos "stock based" Team Kawasaki kxf450 supercross dirt bike, in 2010. His frame had welds on it that did not look stock. They were perfect, and his Vin number was hand stamped as "RV 12". On that bike, the claimed value of the works forks was $125,000, the shock the same.

So, on the dirt bike, 250k just for suspension. Yet, if we had 250k and tried to buy the components, we could not.

 

[ukzx10r]

Everything is relative.
I did a track day on my old gen1 and was battling with a lad on a moto3 bike.
He was the lap record holder of moto3 around snetterton in bsb series.
Yet my bike was worth 3500 pounds and his bike was worth ££££££?
Alot more basically.
But to win in moto3 you need the top gear.
But for me i was happier than he was i bet because i was able to lap with a lap record holder and then ride my bike back home on the road