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Discussion Starter #1
Hi !

I am considering now to purchase gear position indicator for my track days(Acumen or digitool)

I read the wokshop manual and found very interesting information...there is already a gear indicator in bone stock ZR10R bike !!! GREAT

In those commercial devices there is a slight delay when the acumen or digitool is calculating the gear info from speed and rev information...

BUT NOW WE HAVE ALREADY THE CORRECT INFORMATION IN SOME ELECTRIC WIRES !!! Now I need only an ordinary electric numeral indicator...

See attached copy from the ZX10R work shop manual...there is different voltage for each gear in certain electrick wire !

Any experience yet ???
 

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MAn that seems like someone with a elcetrical engineer background could make a adapter for the wiring harness and program a ic chip to display a gear # when corresponding voltages are input.

I wonder if it is possible and if it can be done cheaper. I know with the digi and accumen that if you ahve a speedohealer andchange the correction ratio you ahve to retrain the gear indicators.

This would be alot simplier and easy.
 

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Cool but won't work for those of us with TRE's.
 

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sneaky said:
Why is that, Ivans TRE has nothing to do with the gear postion indicator.
Okay
 

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Somebody get this worked out cause I want to do it!
 

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sneaky said:
Why is that, Ivans TRE has nothing to do with the gear postion indicator.
Why did I hook it up to my gear position indicator? It's not an Ivan's TRE but still.

From Ivan's, I know he's talking about Suzuki but....
What the manufacturer has done is to make a SEPARATE IGNITION MAP FOR EACH GEAR.
This has been done for either safety and/or emissions reasons. However, it limits the power and smoothness of your bike in the first 1/2 turn of the throttle in gears 1 through 4.


They were clever in the design of this timing retarder. It still allows full timing at full throttle. As you shift up through the gears, the amount of throttle needed to access the advance curve decreases, until you make it into 5th gear and then it's gone. You have nice, smooth operation. Wouldn't you like your bike to respond just as smoothly in the lower gears?TREkit.htm




TREkit.htm




TREkit.htm



 

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I called and talked to Ivan a couple of months ago about his TRE. The one for the Zuks reads and tricks the ECM from the gear position indicator because that is where their retard program comes from.

From what Ivan told me, the Kawasaki TRE is to bypass the fuel cutoff when you chop the throttle and the open it again which causes the abruptness and jerking when on/off the throttle. It is more of a emmissions bypass then a ign retard like the zuks.

on the edit...hence you quoted something from his site about Suzuki's and how they are setup. If you doubt what I am saying then call him, if I am wrong then I will admit it but I am very technological person and understand alot of the programming things that are doen and how they work.

I have seen the fuel cutoff on the dyno, it shows up in the A/F on the powercommander program and after talking to him in detail about it correlates to what he told me when I talked to him about this issue.
 

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Do you have a TRE? I installed mine and it connects to the gear position indicator wires that the guy who started this thread was referring to. Also rotated the sub throttle sensor forward as per instructions.

Again mine is a Dannos Perf TRE but I think He copied Ivan. I had it before I knew of this site or Ivan.
 

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Here
 

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Nope I dont, called Ivan to order it and he advised to not oder it until I got the PCIII because of the sub throttle mod.

On Ivans TRE and if Dans is a exact copy it will work the same when you bypass the emmission program it puts the computer into a bypass mode, the sub throttle mod moves the sensor and makes the computer think the throttle plates are opening sooner to get the ECM out of bypass mode and dumps extra fuel into the low end of the throttle range which is why Ivan suggest only doing the TRE when using a PCIII as you will have to lean out program to compensate for the extra fuel from the sub throttle mod.

I have messed with this stuff for soo long that I am not one of the leapers when mods come out, I do the research and usually call the maker/manufacture to see how it works and find out what any side effects are going to be from the mod.

If you doubt what I am saying call Ivan then and ask him, like I said if I am wrong then cool I am wrong, but this is the info I got from talking to him directly...
 

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Discussion Starter #12
well

Lot of very interesting discussion now...but the thread main question...onboard gear indication and those experiences are still missing ?

thanks !!!
 

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All I am saying is that my bike no longer knows what gear itis in because those wires are no longer connected to the sensor. They are connected to the TRE.

As for the PC3 of course Ivan is right on that, My tre is good with no pc3 but would be better with one, which I will buy from Ivan. I have lost some MPG by not having PC3 to correct for the sub sensor but bike runs well and smooth.

I won't waste Ivan's time until I'm ready to buy from him.


Not trying to argue- this always happens when TRE gets mentioned.:cool:

Sorry for threadjack.
 

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you can read the voltage from the connector into a comparitor circuit that outputs 0 or 5 volts for each gear and then just use a bunch of logic gates to control each segment of a LED display based on that input information. Its called a K-map. You would need power too, but 5 volts should be enough. It would be a good project for a sophmore in EE digital design lab. one call to digikey should get you all the parts...
 

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If you're saying that you could have a gear position indicator on the stock clocks, someone could make some money out of this. I'd buy one
 

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the voltage difference in witch gear your in is determined by gear. if you have a tre your voltage on those two wires will NOT fluxuate. due to the fact that if you installed a tre you installed a resistor in your gear position indicator to make the bike think it was in 5th the entire time.
 

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Wow.

1. The TRE does interface with the GPS (gear position sensor). Sneaky, you need to talk to Ivan again. I've installed the TRE from Ivan on two bikes now. They intercept the GPS signal and modify the output to fool the ECU into thinking it's in 5th gear. This uses the 5th gear mapping from the ECU, which doesn't do the fuel cut-off crap like the other gears, amongst other things.

2. lespaul66's idea is valid. I don't have the EE experience to design a display myself, but I have investigated the possibility of using the GPS output voltage to create a display. Can't figure out why Acumen or others haven't taken advantage of this very simple way to indicate gear position. It would save all the "learning" BS that is required with their current line-up.

3. Although the TRE does modify the output signal from the GPS to the ECU, I can't see why the GPS signal couldn't be accessed and used for display purposes prior to the TRE modification. That is, between the GPS and TRE.

Anyone with the EE ability to create this for a reasonable price would get my $$, FWIW.
 

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Well even if that is the way it works then this mod would still work as long as you intercept the signal BEFORE the TRE modifies the signal.

I had talked to Ivan months ago when I got the 10 and was calling him to order the TRE and he told me not too until I was ready to do the PCIII at the same time, that is why I didnt order a TRE yet. I had asked him about the ign mapping and had thought he had said it was more of a emmission thing over a ign mapping trick.

Its all good though, we all make out mistakes. Live and learn. Like I said though as long as you get the signal before the TRE this should still work.
 

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