Kawasaki ZX-10R Forum banner

1 - 16 of 16 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,167 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
First my truck that i drive to work and play in is a 91 and it has an R-12 system.

I've heard when changing to R-134 freon you have to change the compressor oil/ o-rings and totally vacum the old r-12 out before adding the new R-134

I've also heard this is pure A/C industry B/S and have talked to several people that have added r-134 to older r-12 systems and had no problems, a guy i work with has done this to an older car he has about 3 years ago with no problems yet, he just bought the adapters needed ........and vented the leftover R-12 :headshake ( yea i know thats bad for the O-zone) before adding the R-134.

Have searched the net and found info supporting both sides, just curious if anybody here had some input on it?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
779 Posts
i just went through this (sorta) on my 93 ford. the previous owner had it retrofitted from r-12 to r-134. it needed a recharge, so i took it down to the a/c shop. the owner told me that switching it over to 134 causes you to lose about 20% of the cooling power. he also told me you can use a new freon called .....i think it was called "freeze 12". i guess it's an r-12 substitute that works better than changing the whole system.

here's a link for ya http://www.freeze12.com/

ask your shop if they can get it! good luck
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,167 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Thanks for the link i'll check it out

Are we the only ones here driving older vehicles:lol: :dontknow:

Surely somebody else has some info
 

·
Bloo Moderator
Joined
·
23,742 Posts
In California I read they are getting ready to ban 134 for home mechanics..must be installed by a shop.

The R12 is definitely cooler than the R-134 but more expensive and not available anymore like the 134 and yes adapters are available to convert.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
779 Posts
Thanks for the link i'll check it out

Are we the only ones here driving older vehicles:lol: :dontknow:

Surely somebody else has some info
well, i live in a hurricane prone area, so i wanted a beater. ended up loving the damn thing! i lifted it, add 35" mudders, and voila! the perfect bronco!:eek:ccasion1
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
168 Posts
If you have a leak in your car no shop can fill it back up with R12 you have to get it retrofitted and you cant just do it in your back yard because you have to recover (thats for normal people) then you have to vacuum for at least 20 minutes to get all the moisture out then you charge it. Ive heard people not changing the O rings but you have to vacuum it to work right. I can get a R134 car to blow 40 deg. thats cold enough for me.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
657 Posts
i just went through this (sorta) on my 93 ford. the previous owner had it retrofitted from r-12 to r-134. it needed a recharge, so i took it down to the a/c shop. the owner told me that switching it over to 134 causes you to lose about 20% of the cooling power. he also told me you can use a new freon called .....i think it was called "freeze 12". i guess it's an r-12 substitute that works better than changing the whole system.

here's a link for ya http://www.freeze12.com/

ask your shop if they can get it! good luck
freeze 12 is a propane based refrigerant and should not be used. it's a band aid fix, not a true solution.
 

·
Hillbillie Mod
Joined
·
20,155 Posts
how could you consider that knowing the adverse effects it will have on the precious ozone layer! :eyecrazy:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
779 Posts
freeze 12 is a propane based refrigerant and should not be used. it's a band aid fix, not a true solution.
freeze 12 is not propane based. "FR-12" or "Freeze-12" or "Frigc" are simply 134a with an additive that makes it slightly less violently incompatible with mineral oil

OZ-12 or HC-12 are blends of isobutane and isopropane. They work very well in R-12 systems, and have no oil incompatibility problems. THEY are flammable.

There are quite a number of drawbacks to R134a in R12 systems. 134a moves much less heat than 12, which means that your 12 system's effectiveness will be sharply cut, especially when you need it most (stuck in traffic/real hot days). 134a is not compatible with the oil used in R12 systems, and the oil required for 134a reacts poorly with residues that cannot be flushed from a system that has run on 12. This reaction breaks down the oil and frequently destroys the compressor.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
779 Posts

·
Hillbillie Mod
Joined
·
20,155 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
779 Posts
Cow flatulence

It has been estimated that 9 to 12% of the energy that a cow consumes is turned to methane that is released either through flatulence or burping (Radford, 2001). A huge number of factors affect methane emission, including diet, barn conditions and whether the cow is lactating, but an average cow in a barn produce 542 liters of methane a day, and 600 liters when out in a field (Adam, 2000).

These estimates were made using a trace gas (sulphur hexofluoride) that was released at known points within a barn containing 90 cattle. Levels of this trace gas and CO2 are then measured 30 metres downwind of the shed and thus they can estimate how much CO2 is released per cow per day. All this methane can add up to a significant amount. Australia's 140 million sheep and cattle are estimated to produce one seventh of the nation's total greenhouse gas emissions, whilst America's 100 million cattle also are major contributors (Major, 2000).

:crackup: :lol: :badteeth:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,134 Posts
they make R-134 retrofit kits at all autoparts stores for like 35 bucks. it comes with all the fittings you need to switch it over and 3 cans of R-134 including the fill hose. Besides having the old r-12 flushed fully I would recommend changing the evaporator and the orifice tube since R-134 and R-12 don't mix well and can cause blockages...
 

·
Supercharged Mod
Joined
·
4,392 Posts
In California I read they are getting ready to ban 134 for home mechanics..must be installed by a shop.
Already like this in Canada ... has been like this for years.

Personally, if it was my car, I would use HC-12 (basically propane) and forget about it. Yes, the refrigeration industry doesn't like it because propane is cheap and doesn't have to be purchased from the refrigeration industry itself (follow the $$$) and the flammability is given as an excuse. But, the flammable gas is contained within a closed system, and if something major happens that disrupts the system (e.g. a front end collision that destroys the condenser), you've got far greater concerns ... like the vehicle's own fuel system, that contains far more flammable stuff than the small contents of the A/C system ...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,167 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
Well i don't really want to change out any of my A/C parts to retrofit like it SHOULD be done, i know the way the shops want it done. Just trying to figure out if anybody has just added R134a or similar to a old R12 without anything locking up.

If nothing else since i live close to Mexico now i may just run across the border and buy some R-12 and fill it myself in the parking lot.

Can't import it back to the US but i can fill my system over there:cool: , that may be the best option
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,893 Posts
I bought one of the kits for my old nissan. All it was was the different caps so the 134 adapter would fit on. It would cool but didnt get anywhere close to as cold as the r12. This was also about 8 years ago though.
 
1 - 16 of 16 Posts
Top