Cam Chain Tensioner problem

21835 Views 25 Replies 16 Participants Last post by lukky14, May 8, 2017

JepoyDaNinja

Discussion Starter · Dec 25, 2016

So it has been 2 weeks since I turned in my bike to the dealership to get the "cam-chain tensioner" fix. 3 days ago they called me and gave me an update about it and they told me that they have installed the new parts - I waited 2 weeks to get the parts in - from Kawi, but it is still making the noise.

They told me that they are going to get in touch with a Kawi tech sometime next week to pinpoint the problem.

Has anyone had this problem with their 2016 ZX10R? Service wise......

I trust the dealership because I already bought two bikes from them and I know their service techs (well experienced) very well, but installing some new parts still hasn't fixed the problem........

Thanks!

1 - 20 of 26 Posts

tdh

· #2 · Dec 25, 2016

Personally I've not had a lot of noise out of my '16 (yet) and I really wouldn't get too concerned if I did get some cam chain noise personally. I also have a '14 ZX10R and a couple of ZX6Rs. Both of my ZX6Rs would get pretty noisy and my '14 ZX10R is much worse than my '16 at the moment. But, you have to expect a certain amount of noise from a ratcheting type cam chain tensioner.

It should be the quietest right after it auto-adjusts to the next click, and that is the point when the tension should be at it's "optimal". As the guides and chain wear the tension will get lower and lower until which point it's low enough for the tensioner to click another notch. During that time the chain will get a bit noisy, and not necessarily bad mechanically, it's just annoying to the ear and it "sounds" like something is wrong when it might not be. One thing people do that is a very bad thing and shouldn't be done, is they back the bolts on the tensioner until they hear the next click and then tighten them back up. Sure, it stops the chain noise, but it also puts too much tension on the chain which at best will cause things to wear faster than they should. I put manual tensioners in my ZX6R so I could fine tune the tension. Manual tensioners are infinitely variable where the OEM ratcheting type adjusts tension in increments.

Having said that, I believe the OEM tensioner has a tendency to stick, and not adjust when it should. When that happens you should pull the tensioner completely out, clean and lube it with oil and verify it's working then reinstall according to the manual. The chain may still not be at the point where the adjuster is between clicks and still making noise, but it will be adjusted properly.

In your case, the dealer replaced the tensioner with a new one and it is still making chain noise and I would say there are 2 likely reasons for that. 1) The chain is between clicks on the tensioner and is normal noise, confirmed that both your old and new tensioner exhibit the same amount of noise or 2) the noise is completely unrelated to the cam chain tensioner and possibly unrelated to the cam chain.

It's hard to accept that some noise coming from the cam chain area is "working properly" but that certainly can be the case. Hard to say without hearing it in person.

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EJR

· #3 · Dec 27, 2016

The hell with the dealers. If it is the same tensioner as the 11-15, you can manually adjust. Pull it out and pull the plunger a click or two out. It's a one way plunger. I would say go one click at a time. If you can't install the tensioner back in, you've probably pulled it out too far. But, if the thing doesn't fully seat (1-2 mm gap), toss the bolts in and tighten them down. Did this on a bike, got rid of the noise.

Gen-Eric

· #4 · Dec 27, 2016

My bike started making the clicking noise at about 300 miles and only got worse through 1000 miles. I self diagnosed/assumed it was the CCT based on a youtube video posted by another forum member, and all the complaints about the CCT. My dealer finally decided to replace it under warranty, and I confirmed on their parts order that the part they ordered was a different part number than the original CCT. It's the same part # that OEM parts sites now show - something like a bunch of 99999-999

12048A
TENSIONER-ASSY
12048-0096[old] 99999-0573[new]

One of the techs said the new part is actually the tensioner from their older models, I think pre-2016. My point here is maybe the dealer put in the bad tensioner, part # 12048-0096

Anyways, after the dealer replaced the tensioner, the issue is gone, and now my bike sounds like an old MAC truck

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SkyDork

· #5 · Dec 27, 2016

EJR said:
The hell with the dealers. If it is the same tensioner as the 11-15, you can manually adjust. Pull it out and pull the plunger a click or two out. It's a one way plunger. I would say go one click at a time. If you can't install the tensioner back in, you've probably pulled it out too far. But, if the thing doesn't fully seat (1-2 mm gap), toss the bolts in and tighten them down. Did this on a bike, got rid of the noise.

It is NOT the same tensioner as the Gen 4. It can't be easily adjusted manually like the older style.

th3r3ds0x

· #6 · Dec 27, 2016

You actually can back it out like the older models to advance a click at a time. I did it with mine. Loosened one bolt then very slowly loosened the other until hearing a click, tightened it back up. That method worked but since there is the chance of over tightening the chain I decided to install an APE tensioner. Wish I had done it a lot sooner. Also folks say the tensioners rarely fail but I have seen pics of several that had failed (teeth on the plunger worn slightly allowing the plunger to go back and forth across several teeth). Install a manual tensioner and enjoy your bike. The stock tensioner is a piece of cake to put back in if you happen to need to take it in for warranty work.

tdh

· #7 · Dec 27, 2016 (Edited)

Loosening until you hear a click and tightening back up may stop the noise but it puts too much tension on the chain and will cause the chain and guides to wear out more quickly. That's why there is a big bold warning in the service manual saying not to do that.

Reactions: 2

JepoyDaNinja

Discussion Starter · #8 · Dec 27, 2016

Thanks for the replies guys. Bike is still under warranty so I didn't hesitate to bring it in to the dealership. The only thing that worries me is that they have installed a brand spanking new CCT and they said it is still making the noise.

They said they are going to talk to a kawi tech tomorrow and diagnose it from there. Hopefully the kawi tech knows the real answer to their question.

bdouglas119

· #9 · Feb 20, 2017

Gen-Eric said:
My bike started making the clicking noise at about 300 miles and only got worse through 1000 miles. I self diagnosed/assumed it was the CCT based on a youtube video posted by another forum member, and all the complaints about the CCT. My dealer finally decided to replace it under warranty, and I confirmed on their parts order that the part they ordered was a different part number than the original CCT. It's the same part # that OEM parts sites now show - something like a bunch of 99999-999

12048A
TENSIONER-ASSY
12048-0096[old] 99999-0573[new]

One of the techs said the new part is actually the tensioner from their older models, I think pre-2016. My point here is maybe the dealer put in the bad tensioner, part # 12048-0096

Anyways, after the dealer replaced the tensioner, the issue is gone, and now my bike sounds like an old MAC truck

after having the new CCT installed, has the problem come back?

Reactions: 1

Gen-Eric

· #10 · Feb 27, 2017

bdouglas119 said:
after having the new CCT installed, has the problem come back?

No, issue appears to be resolved.

Nfamous60

· #11 · Mar 2, 2017

What about the aftermarket options to replace the oem. Has anyone done that?

Proteus

· #12 · Mar 3, 2017

EJR said:
The hell with the dealers. If it is the same tensioner as the 11-15, you can manually adjust. Pull it out and pull the plunger a click or two out. It's a one way plunger. I would say go one click at a time. If you can't install the tensioner back in, you've probably pulled it out too far. But, if the thing doesn't fully seat (1-2 mm gap), toss the bolts in and tighten them down. Did this on a bike, got rid of the noise.

On my '11 that was the fix. It never did self-adjust and finally the racket became so bad I pulled it off and adjusted to the next notch manually and then reinstalled. Noise all gone now and it purrs like a kitten. I also noticed a nice increase in low end throttle response after the adjust and smoother idling. In my opinion, KHI needs to get their act together and design an automatic CCT that actually works, way too many threads on this subject on the internet.

Reactions: 1

dricked

· #13 · Mar 3, 2017

Nfamous60 said:
What about the aftermarket options to replace the oem. Has anyone done that?

Yes. Screw auto tensioners.

10Arghh

· #14 · Mar 3, 2017

Sorry slightly off topic, but you know it is recommended to pull the cam cover off and zip tie the cam chain to the cam before you ever pull out a cam chain adjuster...This is to avoid the risk of the chain jumping a cam sprocket tooth and messing up the timing when the tension is reduced.

My question is, is there a position that you can put the engine in, so as to avoid having to do this? Is there a position where the chain is the most taut and so is less likely to jump?

APE say to put the piston position at TDC...Is this the reason?

Thanks.

Lanister

· #15 · Mar 3, 2017

10Arghh said:
Sorry slightly off topic, but you know it is recommended to pull the cam cover off and zip tie the cam chain to the cam before you ever pull out a cam chain adjuster...This is to avoid the risk of the chain jumping a cam sprocket tooth and messing up the timing when the tension is reduced.

My question is, is there a position that you can put the engine in, so as to avoid having to do this? Is there a position where the chain is the most taut and so is less likely to jump?

APE say to put the piston position at TDC...Is this the reason?

Thanks.

Yes, APE instructions refer to TDC specifically for this reason. I've installed mine (Pro version) using this method and it was a breeze.

10Arghh

· #16 · Mar 3, 2017

Lanister said:
Yes, APE instructions refer to TDC specifically for this reason. I've installed mine (Pro version) using this method and it was a breeze.

Thanks

bun1t

· #17 · Mar 3, 2017

Gen-Eric said:
My bike started making the clicking noise at about 300 miles and only got worse through 1000 miles. I self diagnosed/assumed it was the CCT based on a youtube video posted by another forum member, and all the complaints about the CCT. My dealer finally decided to replace it under warranty, and I confirmed on their parts order that the part they ordered was a different part number than the original CCT. It's the same part # that OEM parts sites now show - something like a bunch of 99999-999

12048A
TENSIONER-ASSY
12048-0096[old] 99999-0573[new]

One of the techs said the new part is actually the tensioner from their older models, I think pre-2016. My point here is maybe the dealer put in the bad tensioner, part # 12048-0096

Anyways, after the dealer replaced the tensioner, the issue is gone, and now my bike sounds like an old MAC truck

This is correct. The new part number is similar to the Gen 4 style CCT. They said the original 16 style was putting too much tension on the chain.

EJR

· #18 · Mar 9, 2017

No, the position of the pistons will not affect the tension on the chain. The way I did it which is the easiest and guarantees accuracy is to clean the oil off the cam sprockets and the chain and put a line in white out or permanant marker across the sprocket and chain. Then just remove the cams, do your work, put them back in and adjust the teeth on the chain until the lines line up. The only thing you need to be careful of is dropping the chain down in the motor. Let me know if you have any questions, I know the motor and the work pretty good.

10Arghh

· #19 · Mar 12, 2017

EJR said:
Then just remove the cams

This seems like complete unnecessary overkill.

Why not just zip tie the chain to to the cams (do both cams if you really have to), the chain won't then move when you take out the CCT and your timing won't be thrown out.

Unless you're doing your valve adjustment at the same time, I wouldn't be taking out cams to fit a CCT.

Bottoms-Up

· #20 · Mar 12, 2017

I've installed a few of the APE manual CCT's I've never removed the cams.

It's a easy like 1/2hr job. Remove the old one, install the new, adjust, done.

Nothing more to it.

Might have to remove the one rad hose, no need to drain rad, just remove hose
for extra room.

If you are removing cam's for valve adjust the best thing to do is to just
mark cam/chain with paint pen put a couple on a couple of bungee cords on the chain to keep tension.

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