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I want to get a Brembo master cyclinder. These come in different versions which vary braking force for a given force at the lever. The specs I am considering are 19x16, 19x18, and 19x20 with 19x20 giving the least braking force and 19x16 the most.

My question is will the 19x16 give too much braking force and reduce feel at the lever, or is it actually nice to use. Likewise, will the 19x20 require too much lever force and be a pain to use?
 

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i always thought the 19x16 used more travel and the 19x20 was like a switch and was very on off as it didnt use much travel or need much pressure?
 

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nice write up here -

Tito said:
Dual Disc

The Brembo aftermarket radial 19mm diameter master cylinders offer you the choice of a brake lever fulcrum-to-piston distance of either 16mm, 18mm or 20mm. The stock lever is 16mm.

So your choices from Brembo are 19x16, 19x18 or 19x20.

19x16 (stock) requires the least less lever effort but the longest pull distance.

19x18 requires 11% lighter pull and 11% longer pull distance than the 19x20 MC. More feel (better modulation characteristics) than the 19x20

19x20 requires the most lever force but the shortest pull. More like a trigger action.

Some riders think that this short-pull trigger action means that they have "better" brakes, but they don't - at least not for all riding conditions. What they do get is the same braking power with poorer modulation (feel) characteristics. Good for the track perhaps, but often dangerous on the street, especially in the wet. In an emergency, most of us have the instinct to grab a brake hard. So if you value a better feel, when choosing between the 19x18 and the 19x20 for the street, go for the 19X18. Better still stay with Ducati’s choice, 19x16.

On the other hand, some prefer their lever hard.

So again, I'm not suggesting that every rider will have the same preference in a braking system's modulation characteristics. Depending on your preference (or need) you can have brakes with an initial vague feeling, a strong initial bite, or something in between. You can select pads that have better high temperature behavior. On a race bike you can select brake pad and rotor material that will survive a race without needing replacement, but on the street, materials need to be more durable and function under less severe braking conditions and more varied weather conditions.
Master Cylinder Piston Diameter Selection

Brembo makes 16mm diameter piston master cylinders for use with single caliper brakes and 19mm diameter for use with dual calipers. Why? To give the proper modulation characteristics at the lever. The different diameter MC pistons change the hydraulic relationship between the master cylinder and the caliper pistons.

The hydraulic advantage is the total area of the caliper pistons divided by the area of the master cylinder.


The Brembo Goldline front caliper has four pistons. Two are 30mm diameter, two are 34mm.


The Brembo Monoblock front caliper has four pistons. Two are 32mm diameter, two are 36mm.

Case 1: A single Goldline actuated by a 16mm MC.

2(30 x 30 + 36 x 36) / (16 x 16) = 2(900 + 1296)/256 = 17 >13

Case 2: Dual Goldlines actuated by a 19mm MC.

4(30 x 30 + 36 x 36) / (19 x 19) = 4(2196)/361 = 27 < 24 > 23 (firm)

Case 3: Dual Monoblocks actuated by a 19mm MC.

4(32 x 32 + 36 x 36) / (19 x 19) = 4(1024 + 1296)/361 = 27 < 26 > 23

It has been my experience that there is a "sweet spot" in the range. I like ratios in the 27:1 range-2 finger power brakes, feeling some line and/or caliper flex.

23:1 is at the other end of the spectrum-firm.


Case 4: Dual Goldlines actuated by a 16mm MC.

4(30 x 30 + 36 x 36) / (16 x 16) = 4(2196)/256 = 34 > 27 (loose)

Case 5: A single Goldline actuated by a 19mm MC.

2(30 x 30 + 36 x 36) / (19 x 19) = 2(900 + 1296)/361 = 12 < 23 NG

Ratios lower than 23:1 produce a lever feel so "wooden" as to have little, if any feel.
 

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You have to try them both and then you'll find out which one is best for you. I have a 19x18 and 19x20 I loved the 18 until I recently tried the 20. The 19x18 is a definite improvement over stock no question it has intial bite and progressive feel. The 19x20 have alot more intial bite and a little better feel (to me). Didnt like how the 19x18 travelled so far under hard braking it was too close to the bars. So Long story short if you have the a chance try both.

Cheers,
 

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My prior, limited--and fairly analogous--experience with using a 5/8" bore m/c with a brake system designed for a 14mm bore m/c resulted in a very firm lever feel, but diminished control over fine brake modulation. The firmer feel did not necessarily translate into greater braking power, as Tito discussed, but instead simply resulted in needing to use more force on the lever in exchange for less precise modulation. I'm certain that the higher-leverage options for the 19mm radial m/c would yield similar results. I prefer greater modulation/control to a firmer lever feel, but everyone has their own preference. :thumbsup:

I'm running a 19x18 Brembo on my 10, which offers great feel/modulation AND great power (as so many others have said . . . ), and, while there is a fair amount of lever travel under heavy braking, it does not feel "soft" by any stretch of the imagination. I'm sure you'd be happy with this setup as well!:mrgreen:

GD
 

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Tito said:
19x18 for all uses... There is a ton of brake power and the feel couldn't be any more perfect (with the srjl vesrah pads).
+1 The best choice for sure. While it has tremendous power it is more progressive. And yes I just switched to the Vesrahs and would recommend them as well as they are amazing.
 

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HKMP7 said:
You have to try them both and then you'll find out which one is best for you. I have a 19x18 and 19x20 I loved the 18 until I recently tried the 20. The 19x18 is a definite improvement over stock no question it has intial bite and progressive feel. The 19x20 have alot more intial bite and a little better feel (to me). Didnt like how the 19x18 travelled so far under hard braking it was too close to the bars. So Long story short if you have the a chance try both.

Cheers,
I use the 19x18 and race with it on tracks that have a large deal of braking and have never had it even lose any feel or even come close to the bars. I think that may have to do with your brake fluid and pads and maybe you need a better bleed next time. I would not really recommend a 19x20 to anyone unless you you have a ton of experience and know how to control your brakes very precisely as they have a ton of initial bite. Just my .02
 

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zx10ragentblack said:
I think that may have to do with your brake fluid and pads and maybe you need a better bleed next time.
:crackup:

Apprently you dont know who I am. I think I have my brakes under control. Ive built numerous superbikes and Im speaking from many years of experience. Let the guy chose for himself your set up might not be the best for everyone.

Let me know when that yellow number plate turns into a white one lol.
 

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HKMP7 said:
:crackup:

Apprently you dont know who I am. I think I have my brakes under control. Ive built numerous superbikes and Im speaking from many years of experience. Let the guy chose for himself your set up might not be the best for everyone.

Let me know when that yellow number plate turns into a white one lol.
Nor do I care. Just speaking from my experience is all and I have found the 19x18 to work great. I will have white plates next year as this is my first year of racing so not that it matters but I aint slow. Experience whatever, I race currently and have tried a few things and IMHO the 19x18 is the best option for me. He is asking the question so we can give him our opinions. He is free to make up his mind on his own I am just stating what I think would work for him.:thumbsup:
 

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Careful you might offend someone. What happen to the good old days when everybody wasn't a know it all. Hey kid let me know when your race budget gets over $60000 a season. Until then I have a Unfair advantage. Not trying to get in a pissing contest but you can give your opinion without discrediting someone else's.

Cheers,

P.S. I was born and raised in Indiana so I love all fellow Hooiser's.:hello:
 

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HKMP7 said:
Careful you might offend someone. What happen to the good old days when everybody wasn't a know it all. Hey kid let me know when your race budget gets over $60000 a season. Until then I have a Unfair advantage. Not trying to get in a pissing contest but you can give your opinion without discrediting someone else's.

Cheers,

P.S. I was born and raised in Indiana so I love all fellow Hooiser's.:hello:
Come on man. Not discrediting what you said at all. I just think since he is new to the brembo maybe he should start out with something more progressive is all. Who am I offending??? I am not saying I know it all...far from it. I just know what my experience has been with the brembo m/c's. Also what org do you race with and what area are yah from?

P.S. I aint exactly a Hoosier, born and raised in northern Wisconsin so maybe thats why yah dont like me...lol j/k:lol: :thumbsup:
 

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HKMP7 said:
Careful you might offend someone. What happen to the good old days when everybody wasn't a know it all. Hey kid let me know when your race budget gets over $60000 a season. Until then I have a Unfair advantage. Not trying to get in a pissing contest but you can give your opinion without discrediting someone else's.

Cheers,

P.S. I was born and raised in Indiana so I love all fellow Hooiser's.:hello:
Your not trying to get in a pissing contest but then again you are with quotes of race budget $$$ and remarks such as 'what happened to the good ol days when everybody wasn't a know it all' and making references such as this 'Let me know when that yellow number plate turns into a white one lol' that aren't necessary.
The fact is zx10ragentblack expressed his opinions about his experience on the topic and as far as i can tell didn't lie or misinform anyone so please move along.

As always the internet provides a place for those well versed and those not so well versed so just like you and me and many others we all gain experience and learn to be more knowlegable that we can share it openly.

BD
 

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HKMP7 said:
Careful you might offend someone. What happen to the good old days when everybody wasn't a know it all. Hey kid let me know when your race budget gets over $60000 a season. Until then I have a Unfair advantage. Not trying to get in a pissing contest but you can give your opinion without discrediting someone else's.
:notworthy :rolleyes:
 

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I was just giving him a hard time. :wink: No sore feelings if I offended anyone my apologies.


Cheers,
 

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HKMP7 said:
:crackup:

Apprently you dont know who I am.

I dont know who you are. :dontknow:

Will the brembo MC's work with any levers or just the one that it comes with? Or does it come with one?
 
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