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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Just read the August 2009 edition of SuperBike Magazine - get one at Borders, or wherever - has a plenty of good articles. Unfortunately, I can't link to the article - you have to buy the mag.

There is no question the authors are aware the 10R is FAR superior then any other bike profiled in the mag including the R1. They only have one article on the 10R and all other brands have specs like “top speed” 140s-160s and nothing has a ¼ mile time in the 10s. The 10R does 9s with a good rider. Enough of the magazine’s bias against the 10R by lack of information - guess Kawi doesn’t have to pay money to these mags to advertise and promote their product - they know it sells based on word of mouth.

What caught my interest is an article on page 8 titled, "The Truth is in There - a lot has been written about the R1’s cross-plane crank engine. But the big question remains. Why does it feel so good to ride on the road when performance and dyno tests show it to be se average? Superbike uncovers the facts.” Where'd all the power go in the R1? It goes into length about how folks feel it rides better; however, the 10R shows much more power on the dyno. Where did the power go they ask? They finally answer their own question (I think they were paid good by Yamaha) and here it is, it's a ridiculous assertion:

First they show a dyno chart (below). As you can see the 10R hp line towers over the R1 from left to right at all RPM ranges, and I mean towers.



Then they ask again, where did the missing power go and show a second dyno chart. This chart both lines are almost together across the chart from left to right. This dyno was performed at 40% throttle. They did this because dyno's are always based on max throttle position.

Then they answer their own question and say, "the power is not missing, it didn't go anywhere". They found R1s perform with exceptional power at 40% throttle which supports why folks who test drive rave about how it feels powerful - (in and around town or at less than 1/2 throttle).

Reality is the R1 performs just like the 10R and others around 40% throttle.

What is up with the magazine bias or have I just not noticed it? Does the flow of advertisement money have anything to do with the bias?
 

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Yeah, one of my primary interests when looking for a new bike is how it compares to the other bikes at 40% throttle. Maybe they could test an R6 at 60% throttle against the !0 at 40%. They might be able to prove the R6 has as much power as the 10 under a specific set of circumstances. Yeah boy.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Yeah, one of my primary interests when looking for a new bike is how it compares to the other bikes at 40% throttle. Maybe they could test an R6 at 60% throttle against the !0 at 40%. They might be able to prove the R6 has as much power as the 10 under a specific set of circumstances. Yeah boy.
Journalistic smoke and mirrors - it's a partial truth - and they think we're idiots? I should scan the whole article..
 

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I think Yamaha paid SuperBike Magazine's, light bill, ink cost, and paper cost for the month of August. That is a bunch of Bull:shit:
 

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Journalistic smoke and mirrors - it's a partial truth - and they think we're idiots? I should scan the whole article..
you really missed the point though reread the article. The R1 when you give part throttle gives more then you asked, give it 40% you really get 50% give it 20 % you really get 30%, at 80% it then goes to 1 to 1. This helps offset the lack of power and is what gives the feeling of being connect to the rear tire and the "massive" (what a joke) low end that R1 guys are raving about. They are so biased that they can't understand or won't understand that the cross plank engine is just marketing and electronic bullshit.

BTW the scan yo posted isn't about hp its to show the crank fluctuation between the 2 notice that there really isn't any difference if anything the R1's is higher, so weres the R1's advantage? o wait there isn't any.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Here are some select quotes from the article by Bob Gray - need to buy SuperBike Magazine to get the whole poop (a great magazine actually):



 

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Discussion Starter #8
Check out the 1, 2, 3, 4 on the left:

1 - Analysts of actual throttle valve opening shows ECU gives you more than you ask for at midrange revs and medium twistgrip openings.. (wow - a responsive throttle due to improved twist grip openings - only in midrange revs)...

2 - 2009 bike has shorter gearing, which makes it feel more sprightly (ok, not stupid here - you think they lowered the gears b/c it's lacking hp?)

3 - Fluctuations in crank speed from crossplane firing order appear measurable (ok, only "measurable" - what the heck?)

4 - Damping in tyre, chain and cush drive may reduce crankshaft effects at contact patch ("may" reduce crankshaft effects - ok and...)
 

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Dont mess wit White Ninja
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I go by feel and what I see with my own two eyes. What I have seen so far is complete bs with the new 09 r1!!! They had to pay someone with that!!! Its a joke haha
 

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Discussion Starter #10
This things a pile of crap and I almost bought one - glad I didn't...
 

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Discussion Starter #11
you really missed the point though reread the article. The R1 when you give part throttle gives more then you asked, give it 40% you really get 50% give it 20 % you really get 30%, at 80% it then goes to 1 to 1. This helps offset the lack of power and is what gives the feeling of being connect to the rear tire and the "massive" (what a joke) low end that R1 guys are raving about. They are so biased that they can't understand or won't understand that the cross plank engine is just marketing and electronic bullshit.

BTW the scan yo posted isn't about hp its to show the crank fluctuation between the 2 notice that there really isn't any difference if anything the R1's is higher, so weres the R1's advantage? o wait there isn't any.
Thanks for pointing this out.. The thing that really stands out in the magazine is how the other bikes (Aprilia, Ducati, and Yamaha) get 11's in the 1/4 mile and have top speeds and overall power significantly less than the Kawi but they don't show any 10R specs.. :iamwithst
 

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I have seen two 09 r1's around me so far, one is a guy I see every week out at are little spot we meet up at and ride every sunday, other ran up on me while on the highway, he saw nothing but my tail light...Yeah theres been a couple members that have made the mistake on here....

I didnt notice that, 11's wow!!! Thats slow!!
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I have seen two 09 r1's around me so far, one is a guy I see every week out at are little spot we meet up at and ride every sunday, other ran up on me while on the highway, he saw nothing but my tail light...Yeah theres been a couple members that have made the mistake on here....

I didnt notice that, 11's wow!!! Thats slow!!
Yep, they show the '08 & '09 R1 as having 157 & 158 hp respectively, and you know it weighs more than the 10R.. The 10R has 189 hp..

One page shows the competitors (aprilla, yamaha & suzuki), minus the Kawi, and their specs showing in low 11s in the 1/4 mile..
 

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I have seen two 09 r1's around me so far, one is a guy I see every week out at are little spot we meet up at and ride every sunday, other ran up on me while on the highway, he saw nothing but my tail light...Yeah theres been a couple members that have made the mistake on here....

I didnt notice that, 11's wow!!! Thats slow!!
well straight line the R1 is going to suffer but a good friend of mine (a css racer) rode with a dude on an R1 last weekend. My friend said the R1 didn't seem to suffer up to a 8/10 tenths pace so to put things in perspective there aren't to many people on here that can ride at his 8/10 pace so for most if they are truthful with themselves the R1 will not hold them back and in fact might make your typical rider faster since I do feel the R1 is easier to ride if for no reason because of its lower power and electronic aids (just like a 600 is easier) My only beef with the R1 is the marketing lies and bullshit that Yamaha has told.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
well straight line the R1 is going to suffer but a good friend of mine (a css racer) rode with a dude on an R1 last weekend. My friend said the R1 didn't seem to suffer up to a 8/10 tenths pace so to put things in perspective there aren't to many people on here that can ride at his 8/10 pace so for most if they are truthful with themselves the R1 will not hold them back and in fact might make your typical rider faster since I do feel the R1 is easier to ride if for no reason because of its lower power and electronic aids (just like a 600 is easier) My only beef with the R1 is the marketing lies and bullshit that Yamaha has told.
Depends on what you like - someone who can't harness all the 10R's power may want the R1..
 

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Yep, they show the '08 & '09 R1 as having 157 & 158 hp respectively, and you know it weighs more than the 10R.. The 10R has 189 hp..

One page shows the competitors (aprilla, yamaha & suzuki), minus the Kawi, and their specs showing in low 11s in the 1/4 mile..
Dude i understand you enthusiasm but try to be factual the zx10 DOES NOT have 189 hp or at least not to the wheel, the European R1 makes a lot more HP then the one over here in the states btw. There isn't nearly the difference in power between the R1 and the other European bikes.
 

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Couldnt agree more, I dont read much of these mags about bikes. But I did hear in one that the new r1 for 2009 is the most rider friendly 1000cc super sport out there. I'm sorry to say I dont want a bike thats user friendly, I want a bike thats raw power and my ass hurts after 50 miles!!! I had a yamaha and moved on to big and better things...

189hp for the zx10r for 09 thats bit high lol, even though mine on a dyno at a bike night made over 170 and thats without a power commander or anything. People were impressed when they saw it cause there was a cbr1000rr a 08 with a lot on it, it ran 162 so do the math!! But numbers are numbers!!
 

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Yep, they show the '08 & '09 R1 as having 157 & 158 hp respectively, and you know it weighs more than the 10R.. The 10R has 189 hp..

One page shows the competitors (aprilla, yamaha & suzuki), minus the Kawi, and their specs showing in low 11s in the 1/4 mile..
do a little research, last time I checked the R1 was not designed to be a drag bike :wink:
 

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do a little research, last time I checked the R1 was not designed to be a drag bike :wink:
maybe you should do some research..none of the 1ks was designed to be a drag bike especially Kawi in 04 that has a short wheel base as small as a 600cc bike....but that doesn't mean it can't drag too. :wink:
 

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Really a 1000cc liter class bike isnt design for anything but the track!! So really are zx10r arent ment to be strip bikes but they are!!

You beat me to it "bluedevil"
 
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