Gen 5: 2016- Woolich software update - Page 5 - Kawasaki ZX-10R.net
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post #41 of 106 Old 12-28-2016, 11:27 AM
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The flap is an on/off solenoid. The high rpm is when the solenoid opens the flap while the low rpm is when the flap closes
So to open all the time set high rpm at say 800 rpm and low rpm at 600 rpm. Also, set the low throttle to 0 % and high to whatever the corresponding value is from the stock settings

So if you wanted it open 100% at all times, then you'd set your RPM map to something like this:
Name:  RPM.jpg
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And your TPS map to something like this:
Name:  TPS.jpg
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post #42 of 106 Old 12-28-2016, 12:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZX10RArcher View Post
The flap is an on/off solenoid. The high rpm is when the solenoid opens the flap while the low rpm is when the flap closes
So to open all the time set high rpm at say 800 rpm and low rpm at 600 rpm. Also, set the low throttle to 0 % and high to whatever the corresponding value is from the stock settings

So if you wanted it open 100% at all times, then you'd set your RPM map to something like this:
Attachment 388865

And your TPS map to something like this:
Attachment 388873

Just for understanding purposes...
On the flapper values in stock setting...

In wide open throttle and 6th gear...
The flapper closes at 3,300 RPMs....
Then open at 3,500 RPMs....??

So we are pretty much un-restricted up top..
The flapper opens up MORE as you shift up the gears...?

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post #43 of 106 Old 12-28-2016, 03:44 PM
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Low is the set point the flap closes; Rpms fall below this? Flap closes.
High is the set point the flap opens; RPMS rise above this? Flap opens.

TPS map shows the high and low points that prompt the drive motor to do what it needs to do in order to open or close the valve. Low - deactivated / High - Active

As stated several times, the flapper valve isn't a power curbing measure; it's simply a way to curb noise for EPA/sound cert. They don't test the bikes at WOT in 4th, 5th, 6th gear. They test them in the ranges that they will be used on the street, hence why they more choked down in those ranges than at the very very top end.
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post #44 of 106 Old 12-28-2016, 04:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZX10RArcher View Post
Low is the set point the flap closes; Rpms fall below this? Flap closes.
High is the set point the flap opens; RPMS rise above this? Flap opens.

TPS map shows the high and low points that prompt the drive motor to do what it needs to do in order to open or close the valve. Low - deactivated / High - Active

As stated several times, the flapper valve isn't a power curbing measure; it's simply a way to curb noise for EPA/sound cert. They don't test the bikes at WOT in 4th, 5th, 6th gear. They test them in the ranges that they will be used on the street, hence why they more choked down in those ranges than at the very very top end.
Ah ok...Make sense...
wouldn't it still reduce power in the lower range since to reduce noise it would still have to restrict air flow?

Any reason why they did not add it to the usa models on the Gen 4? since the epa regulations are the same durring the gen 5 period?

Thanks much for the break down...

Knowing is half the battle....

Yooooo Joe!

lol

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post #45 of 106 Old 12-28-2016, 04:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vonstallin View Post
Ah ok...Make sense...
wouldn't it still reduce power in the lower range since to reduce noise it would still have to restrict air flow?

Any reason why they did not add it to the usa models on the Gen 4? since the epa regulations are the same durring the gen 5 period?

Thanks much for the break down...

Knowing is half the battle....

Yooooo Joe!

lol
In first gear and second, It would make a bit of difference If you have a sensitive dyno butts, few HP before 8000 RPM, this bike power curve starts at 8000-9000 RPM so it really didn't matter if you remove the flapper which it opens at 8000 RPM and in 6th gear you will never hit 3000RPM anyway to make any difference in HP.
the new Gen 5 is Euro 4 emission which is a bit more restrict than USA EPA, Kawasaki doesn't make different emission set up for each country anymore, they all are Euro4 emission now which will pass in any country.
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post #46 of 106 Old 12-28-2016, 08:23 PM
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is anyone else experiencing the software freezing up? locking up and re-booting the computer?
Since logging in recently it locks up every time...nothing else has changed on my lap top.

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post #47 of 106 Old 12-28-2016, 09:26 PM
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KEBC = Kawasaki Engine Braking
Two settings = On and Off (wish we had: On 1, On 2 and Off) to preset some different settings...

The setting "ON" is self explanatory, but I remember even on my R6 flash being told that you really can't turn "OFF" engine braking on stock EBC systems.

Now looking at the Stock KEBC "OFF" maps I see that even when set to OFF EBC will come "ON" at 8000 RPM to 13,000 RPM at 0-100% throttle position....

To totally turn EBC off....
Is it safe to say that if I take the settings starting at 8000 RPM to 13,000 RPM and change them from
0.6 - 3.4 TO 0.0 across the whole map...

There will be "NO" engine braking at all? Completely OFF ?

Here is the OFF map

Off 6th gear (the setting are the same in every gear)


"OFF" 1st Gear




ON Neutral (changes each gear)


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post #48 of 106 Old 12-28-2016, 10:00 PM
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There is KEBC ON and KEBC OFF, we can't put a 1 and a 2 and an off in there, if it isn't already in there how would the dash display it? The dash can only display KEBC / L and KEBC / OFF as such, Kawi only put two maps in there...

KEBC ON (WRT) = KEBC / L displayed on the dash
KEBC OFF (WRT) = KEBC / OFF displayed on the dash

So since there is KEBC On (WRT) which when turned on, on the dash would display "L" that would be KEBC On map. REMEMBER, The L displayed on the dash stands for "LIGHT". In KEBC - L, engine braking is reduced.

KEBC Off (WRT) would be the map that is enabled when on the dash it displays "OFF". With KEBC - OFF, there is more engine braking.

For all intents and purposes, you can repurposes these maps, make KEBC ON (KEBC / L on the dash) be one with even more decreased engine braking and then use the KEBC OFF (KEBC / OFF on the dash) be one with even more increased engine braking. No different than repurposing the power modes M and L into full power mode copies, but with different IGN and FUEL values for different types of fuel.

To see the differences between the maps, simply toggle between them and look at the differences between the KEBC ON and Off and then the gears. You'll see how they handle it, it's pretty simple. Correlate those values to the feeling on the bike. Experiment. Try things out... These are the values that come direct out of the ECU; we didn't magically make them up. If Kawi decided you need a little bit more engine braking in KEBC - L in gears 4 - 6, as compared to 1-3, that is what they decided and that is what they put in there. Change gears 4-6 to match gears 1-3; thats the beauty of the system, you can experiment and try these sorts of things.
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post #49 of 106 Old 12-28-2016, 10:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZX10RArcher View Post
There is KEBC ON and KEBC OFF, we can't put a 1 and a 2 and an off in there, if it isn't already in there how would the dash display it? The dash can only display KEBC / L and KEBC / OFF as such, Kawi only put two maps in there...

KEBC ON (WRT) = KEBC / L displayed on the dash
KEBC OFF (WRT) = KEBC / OFF displayed on the dash

So since there is KEBC On (WRT) which when turned on, on the dash would display "L" that would be KEBC On map. REMEMBER, The L displayed on the dash stands for "LIGHT". In KEBC - L, engine braking is reduced.

KEBC Off (WRT) would be the map that is enabled when on the dash it displays "OFF". With KEBC - OFF, there is more engine braking.

For all intents and purposes, you can repurposes these maps, make KEBC ON (KEBC / L on the dash) be one with even more decreased engine braking and then use the KEBC OFF (KEBC / OFF on the dash) be one with even more increased engine braking. No different than repurposing the power modes M and L into full power mode copies, but with different IGN and FUEL values for different types of fuel.

To see the differences between the maps, simply toggle between them and look at the differences between the KEBC ON and Off and then the gears. You'll see how they handle it, it's pretty simple. Correlate those values to the feeling on the bike. Experiment. Try things out... These are the values that come direct out of the ECU; we didn't magically make them up. If Kawi decided you need a little bit more engine braking in KEBC - L in gears 4 - 6, as compared to 1-3, that is what they decided and that is what they put in there. Change gears 4-6 to match gears 1-3; thats the beauty of the system, you can experiment and try these sorts of things.
From what you are saying....

If KEBC is set to Off = MORE engine braking (more engine braking force)
and
If KEBC L = Low Engine braking (less engine braking force)

The maps values seem to read the opposite of that....

Looking at the map that says EBC OFF...all the values are set to 0.0 in every gear until you hit 8000 - 13000 RPM

While EBC On (L on the dash) shows a bunch of different values at every gear and every RPM and throttle setting.
.
if value 0.0 = nothing
and value 0.1 - 5.5 = more engine braking applied

Off map values range from 0.0 to 3.4
ON map values range from 0.3 to 5.5

Do the bike come preset with a certain amount of engine braking applied...and switching from OFF allows ALL the pre-set engine braking to be used...

While L aka LOW / ON allows for Low /Less engine braking to be applied ?

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Last edited by Vonstallin; 12-28-2016 at 10:41 PM.
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post #50 of 106 Old 12-28-2016, 11:01 PM
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Ok so i went and grabbed the owners manual...

I have to say it is totally confusing im sure to 90% of the users.

Traditionally im sure most think of OFF as NO KEBC....but in kawasakis description it sounds like OFF means NO restrictions to the EBC....full EBC force....

While Low makes sense...a lower setting of force.

Since the values on the map for OFF = 0.0 that must mean NO restrictions...

totally backwards.



in that case would setting the values to

10.0 mean no engine braking ?
if = 0.0 means full on engine braking?

0.0 to 10.0 = Most engine braking to least/no engine braking?

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