Rear tire slippage - tire issue? Suspension issue? Rider issue? - Kawasaki ZX-10R.net
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post #1 of 42 Old 06-22-2014, 11:13 AM Thread Starter
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Rear tire slippage - tire issue? Suspension issue? Rider issue?

Finally had a chance to get the zx10 on the track yesterday, and it seemed to work fairly well, aside from the rear tire slipping EVERYWHERE. I'll be headed to Brainered International Raceway next weekend, so I'd really like to get this resolved soon.

Had several instances mid/mid to late corner, when light on throttle right after apex, where tire would like to brake loose and "kick out" slightly (enough to feel/hear/and pucker up). Started tire pressure at 31psi cold, then dropped to 28psi cold, then to 26psi cold. Problem remained, if anything seemed to get slightly worse (or I was just picking up speed as the day went on)

After looking at the rear shock, I think the preload may be set way to stiff for my weight. Also, compression may be set too stiff? Picture at the bottom.

Me:
Done 3-4 track days, fast intermediate group
160lbs without gear

Bike:
07 ZX10R
mostly stock (pipe, filter, tune, -1 +2)
stock suspension
Newish Pilot Power 3's - no warmers


Suspension setup:

Front Sag: 42mm
Rear Sag: 35mm
Fork Preload: 6 lines showing
Fork Rebound: 7 clicks
Fork Compression: 8 clicks
Shock Rebound: 1.5 turns
Shock Compression: 3 turns

Pictures of the tire and rear shock preload:




Last edited by silversixspeed; 06-22-2014 at 03:27 PM.
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post #2 of 42 Old 06-22-2014, 11:39 AM
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There are a couple of guys on this forum that are better than I am at this, but I’ll toss in what I do know;

Tires – a suspension tuner recently gave me advice at my trackday; drop 2psi at a time until you feel the rear slipping out, then go 2psi back up and you are set. You might have been adding pressure when you should have been dropping.

Suspension – if the spring preload feels about right in general then;
if the bike feels loose/bouncy INCREASE Rebound damping
if the bike feels hard/bumpy (and in your case sliding out) then DECREASE rebound damping

from what you described I’d say your issue was PSI
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post #3 of 42 Old 06-22-2014, 12:04 PM
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Could be the PP3's their a good street tire an adequate track day tire but if you begin to push them they will spinup. Biggest knock on Michelin tires is that they give you no warning before losing grip where as Dunlop and Pirelli will give you some warning they are close to the edge. Since their newish you probably dont want to scrap them but try something different next set you buy.
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post #4 of 42 Old 06-22-2014, 12:11 PM
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It sounds like your rear is too high putting the weight forewards on the bike. I would try and get to 30mm of sag in the front which should help put some weight on the rear tire. What height are your front forks compared to the triple clamps.
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post #5 of 42 Old 06-22-2014, 12:36 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dricked View Post
It sounds like your rear is too high putting the weight forewards on the bike. I would try and get to 30mm of sag in the front which should help put some weight on the rear tire. What height are your front forks compared to the triple clamps.
The forks stick above the upper triple about 4mm.
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post #6 of 42 Old 06-22-2014, 01:17 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
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Could be the PP3's their a good street tire an adequate track day tire but if you begin to push them they will spinup. Biggest knock on Michelin tires is that they give you no warning before losing grip where as Dunlop and Pirelli will give you some warning they are close to the edge. Since their newish you probably dont want to scrap them but try something different next set you buy.
I had thought that too, but with how stiff the rear suspension feels, I don't think it's the case. It wasn't spinning when I was hard on the throttle in the exits, it was more toward apex with lighter throttle. I can push my r6 with q3's much harder, and it still has stock suspension from 1999.
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post #7 of 42 Old 06-22-2014, 01:30 PM
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I would try putting your forks flush and get less sag on the forks.

Also a 600 is much harder to spin up compared to a 1000.

My suspension feels like a rock until you get up to speed but I don't think that's your issue. I had too much rear ride height last year at one point and the rear would spin quite easily but because you haven't/can't change your rear shock length I'm thinking it's your front. Talk to a suspension tuner to help you with the geometry issue.

Last edited by dricked; 06-22-2014 at 01:33 PM.
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post #8 of 42 Old 06-22-2014, 02:58 PM Thread Starter
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Whoops, just noticed I had the shock settings backwards (rebound and compression). Fixed it.
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post #9 of 42 Old 06-22-2014, 03:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silversixspeed View Post
The forks stick above the upper triple about 4mm.
You might want to put the forks back down a bit closer to their stock position. The 06-07 had some geometry issue's if you pulled the forks up to much.
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post #10 of 42 Old 06-22-2014, 03:30 PM Thread Starter
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Added preload to the front (went from 7 lines showing to 5), and backed out the shock rebound and compression just a little. Went for a spirited ride quick, and with the few corners that are near me, it seemed to feel better. Braking was much nicer, too, didn't seem to have quite as much front end dive (but still some).
Couldn't seem to get the rear to spin, even on a bumpier surface. Guess I'll just leave it as is until I get to the track, and adjust from there as necessary.

Thanks for the help guys! Any more suggestions are certainly welcome!
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