Sensation of Speed - Kawasaki ZX-10R.net
 11Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 20 Old 07-17-2017, 06:46 PM Thread Starter
Track Day Rider
 
Honey Badger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: SF Bay Area, CA
Posts: 105
Posting Frequency
 
Garage
Sensation of Speed

I've read about this, I'm aware it exists. I seem to be REALLY struggling with it, especially this past weekend. The bike was feeling much more dialed in, I sorted out a couple settings to a place where I preferred them, and my eyes were moving and my references solid.

My eyes and processing brain were telling me all was good, start braking at point x.

The other voice in my head kept freaking out at how much faster point x was coming up, even though I KNEW point x was PLENTY of time, and I kept starting braking WAY to early - I was braking, lightly, forever in a few places.

I was putting down fairly respectable times on my old bike (Daytona 675), but obviously the ZX gets up to a higher speed between points A and B. Now that the set up things are sorted for the time being, I know I can safely start actions where I think I should, but the extra speed keeps that other voice screaming at me.

Besides seat time and keeping my eyes moving and my references established, anyone else who's moved to the bigger bike who's had to overcome that other voice that insists it's too fast?

I'm rather frustrated that it was a constant problem all weekend....I was literally taking a short vacation between when I'd start braking and actually turn in to turn 1....

I have a few methods to nip at it, but I'm getting impatient with my lack of adjustment to the new bike
JayBoCC2 likes this.

Racing Like a Honey Badger Blog

AFM #302

Special thanks to my 2017 sponsors and supporters!!
Kawasaki USA Team Green; DareDevil Motorsports; Roseville Yamaha-Kawasaki; RiderzLaw; Dainese D-Store SF; BARF Racing; Dunlop Race Tires; Woodcraft; Pacific Track Time; Motion Pro; Skratch Labs; PUSH Laptimer
Honey Badger is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 20 Old 07-17-2017, 08:21 PM
WSB Rider
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 924
Posting Frequency
     
Quote:
Originally Posted by Honey Badger View Post
I've read about this, I'm aware it exists. I seem to be REALLY struggling with it, especially this past weekend. The bike was feeling much more dialed in, I sorted out a couple settings to a place where I preferred them, and my eyes were moving and my references solid.

My eyes and processing brain were telling me all was good, start braking at point x.

The other voice in my head kept freaking out at how much faster point x was coming up, even though I KNEW point x was PLENTY of time, and I kept starting braking WAY to early - I was braking, lightly, forever in a few places.

I was putting down fairly respectable times on my old bike (Daytona 675), but obviously the ZX gets up to a higher speed between points A and B. Now that the set up things are sorted for the time being, I know I can safely start actions where I think I should, but the extra speed keeps that other voice screaming at me.

Besides seat time and keeping my eyes moving and my references established, anyone else who's moved to the bigger bike who's had to overcome that other voice that insists it's too fast?

I'm rather frustrated that it was a constant problem all weekend....I was literally taking a short vacation between when I'd start braking and actually turn in to turn 1....

I have a few methods to nip at it, but I'm getting impatient with my lack of adjustment to the new bike
Your most likely faster on a road race track than 99% of the men on this site, so my advice would be just keep at it, dont give up lol.
JayBoCC2 and Honey Badger like this.
Boxtradamus is offline  
post #3 of 20 Old 07-18-2017, 12:59 AM
Street Rider
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: sunnyvale, ca
Posts: 97
Posting Frequency
 
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by Honey Badger View Post
I've read about this, I'm aware it exists. I seem to be REALLY struggling with it, especially this past weekend. The bike was feeling much more dialed in, I sorted out a couple settings to a place where I preferred them, and my eyes were moving and my references solid.

My eyes and processing brain were telling me all was good, start braking at point x.

The other voice in my head kept freaking out at how much faster point x was coming up, even though I KNEW point x was PLENTY of time, and I kept starting braking WAY to early - I was braking, lightly, forever in a few places.

I was putting down fairly respectable times on my old bike (Daytona 675), but obviously the ZX gets up to a higher speed between points A and B. Now that the set up things are sorted for the time being, I know I can safely start actions where I think I should, but the extra speed keeps that other voice screaming at me.

Besides seat time and keeping my eyes moving and my references established, anyone else who's moved to the bigger bike who's had to overcome that other voice that insists it's too fast?

I'm rather frustrated that it was a constant problem all weekend....I was literally taking a short vacation between when I'd start braking and actually turn in to turn 1....

I have a few methods to nip at it, but I'm getting impatient with my lack of adjustment to the new bike
The only way i can relate to you HB is that earlier this year, B pace scared the pooey out of me, but now i'm running comfortable 2 mins on my own at thill. Like already stated, you have a boatload more skill than i do so my advice is relatively worthless but I think seat time and focusing on your eyes is the only way to really cull that feeling. This is your own barrier/plateu to break and I have no doubt you will get it done. It may also be worth considering that your reference points need to change to compensate for the new levels of acceleration and braking.

Can always do what i'm trying to do to make up the skill gap, throw money at it / track days until you see results. lol
Honey Badger and dalemac like this.
JayBoCC2 is offline  
 
post #4 of 20 Old 07-18-2017, 03:34 AM
Chairman of the Board
 
or10r's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 15,774
Posting Frequency
Images: 17
           
Garage
Repetition for me. Going from wot to full on braking at point x and making the turn time, time after time until that voice was gone and I realized I could move x down the track another 7 feet and start the process over. I'm an upper Intermediate to low advanced rider so I'm sure I'm no where near you HB but that works for me.
Honey Badger likes this.

or10r is offline  
post #5 of 20 Old 07-18-2017, 09:37 AM Thread Starter
Track Day Rider
 
Honey Badger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: SF Bay Area, CA
Posts: 105
Posting Frequency
 
Garage
Guess I'll revert to an old method that worked for me in the past - where I want to roll off, just wait for "1." Then, if there's still plenty of time, next time make it "1, one thousand." Then eventually make that "1, one thousand, 2...."

It's worked for me in the past, unfortunately I'm not the type to just go bombing in and take the chance on blowing the corner (too much street riding -where that's a really stupid idea?), so I need to work at it the other way.

Supposed to be back at the track this weekend, so will hopefully have some good opportunities to work on those things.

Racing Like a Honey Badger Blog

AFM #302

Special thanks to my 2017 sponsors and supporters!!
Kawasaki USA Team Green; DareDevil Motorsports; Roseville Yamaha-Kawasaki; RiderzLaw; Dainese D-Store SF; BARF Racing; Dunlop Race Tires; Woodcraft; Pacific Track Time; Motion Pro; Skratch Labs; PUSH Laptimer
Honey Badger is offline  
post #6 of 20 Old 07-18-2017, 10:10 AM
Track Day Rider
 
ShawnG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 109
Posting Frequency
 
Garage
You're probably 20 mph faster down the straights than you were on the 675 so i would imagine you just gotta get used to the speed. Before you know it im sure you will be going down the straight thinking there's something wrong with the bike and realize you're just used to the speed now lol.
ShawnG is offline  
post #7 of 20 Old 07-18-2017, 11:33 AM
Track Day Rider
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: UK
Posts: 185
Posting Frequency
 
You should probably slow down initially.

Even though you know what the bike is capable of, you have to build the mental reassurance by getting up to top speed incrementally.

Have you enough time to assess how the bike is reacting to bumps on the circuit? How does the bike feel transitioning from side to side in any chicane? What is the drive like out of the corner? Where does the rear start to step out?

You need to be able to answer questions like this, by starting the session at a lower speed so your brain can take in the bigger picture.

It's the same reason the MotoGP practice lap times (especially at the start of a season), are relatively (to them not anyone else) slow compared to what they end up at by quali.

This builds confidence and speed almost automatically....Because everything will feel great once you're confident which will stem from having a pretty good idea about what's happening underneath you.

Also, you probably know this already, but the riding style will have to adjust for a 1000cc.

Forget corner speed (relatively) and use the big horsepower....Get the bike stood up on to the fat part of the tyre as soon as possible and pin the throttle.

This will compromise a traditional oval shaped line through a corner to more of a square style one (in..stop...turn...gas).

Simon Crafar says something like, it's not about who is first to open the throttle, it's who is first to full throttle.

If you haven't read and watched MotoVudu, I can't recommend it enough.

Good luck.

Last edited by 10Arghh; 07-18-2017 at 11:45 AM.
10Arghh is offline  
post #8 of 20 Old 07-18-2017, 11:50 AM
Champion Rider
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: North East FL
Posts: 486
Posting Frequency
 
Something else to keep in mind is the new suite of electronics on the Gen 5 compared to what was on the daytona. They are going to let you get away with a lot. Use that to your advantage.

2016 Kawasaki ZX10R KRT ABS
2016 Suzuki GSX-S 1000 ABS
obijack is offline  
post #9 of 20 Old 07-18-2017, 11:56 AM Thread Starter
Track Day Rider
 
Honey Badger's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: SF Bay Area, CA
Posts: 105
Posting Frequency
 
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by obijack View Post
Something else to keep in mind is the new suite of electronics on the Gen 5 compared to what was on the daytona. They are going to let you get away with a lot. Use that to your advantage.
Ya, other than autoblip and now the whellie control (which I spent a full day testing and getting used to) I don't trust the electronics - in fact, turning my TC to the lowest setting and getting better feedback from the tires/bike INCREASED my confidence - before I couldn't tell where things were or how close things were to having issues. Bike seemed to get off the corners a little better, too.

The majority of my lost time right now is on the brakes - I'm braking WAAAAAY to early. I don't slam on them, and still have decent entry speed, but I'm going to them way to early despite my eyes and references telling me I have a ton of time, but that other little voice keeps freaking out and winning the argument

Started playing around with the rear brake a bit as well. On the 675, since it didn't even have a slipper in it, I could use the clutch to drag the rear wheel...don't have to use the clutch anymore, so started playing around with the rear brake a bit - liked what I was finding, but putting it to practical use that helps reduce laptimes is a few more steps away. Even without that, however, I'm braking a mile too early on the corners where there's harder braking from a higher speed.

Racing Like a Honey Badger Blog

AFM #302

Special thanks to my 2017 sponsors and supporters!!
Kawasaki USA Team Green; DareDevil Motorsports; Roseville Yamaha-Kawasaki; RiderzLaw; Dainese D-Store SF; BARF Racing; Dunlop Race Tires; Woodcraft; Pacific Track Time; Motion Pro; Skratch Labs; PUSH Laptimer
Honey Badger is offline  
post #10 of 20 Old 07-18-2017, 12:59 PM
WSB Rider
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Santa Cruz, CA
Posts: 523
Posting Frequency
 
You can try the slow-roll-off technique. So instead of letting the throttle snap back to zero, control the roll-off as your fingers go to the brake lever. Even a slightly delayed roll-off will put you deeper into the corner.
It will be scary a couple of times but because you'll see that you make the corner every time it should become a part of your comfort zone.
Lanister is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Kawasaki ZX-10R.net forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome