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Gen5 rear suspention link info needed

Gen 5: 2016-20 
51K views 160 replies 22 participants last post by  Poope 
#1 ·
I'm tempted to find out gen5 rear suspension linkage geometry. Hope someone here in forum owning gen5 has shock out and would measure link plate and dogbone dimension. You could maybe get measurements by pressing a piece of carton against linkage bolts (with shock in place) and measure from dent traces.
I attached an image and need measurements A, B, C and D.

Having these measurements I could do some calculations comparing it to gen4 stock and aftermarket link. This could give us first clues if stock link is now optimal for track use, is it closer to gen4 aftermarket or gen4 stock (high ratio, not optimal for racing). And what Ohlins high speed valving to use. Did read here that someone already fitted Ohlins shock on Gen5 and guess shock length is same with gen4, then probably gen5 mounting points have not changed.
 

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#6 ·
The gen 4 shock is longer than the Gen 5.....that is what I read.

Measuring the plate is easy but the dog bone isnt unless i take it off...

I also have Gen 4 Race Links 3.5 and 4.0 from MSS Colechester, along with stock The Gen 5 links look way different to me.
 
#7 ·
I think gen5 link is good for track junkie. Without having numbers, but looking at attached image, I would say two statements.
a) Link is more linear like text says and can see that angle from swingarm bolt to shock bolt is more upright (link rotation causes more initial spring movement).
b) Link ratio must be lower than gen4 (closer to aftermarket ratio, since measurement A/B ratio is better).
Ohlins has already shock (KA364) for 2016, but spring spec. unknown. I estmate when that Ohlins spring is now below 110N then we may not need link replacement.
 

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#8 ·
what model number is the Gen 4 Ohlins TTX?

KA364 for Gen 5 I see you wrote....

For my two Gen 4s I ordered the same Ohlins TTX...but they came with two different model numbers.
I noticed that the adjustment knobs (black and gold) where different shape, but everything else was the same.



when I sell my street Gen 4 I am taking the Ohlins off. I heard the Gen 4 shock is either shorter or longer then Gen 5.

I also wonder if Ohlins making a plug in electronic shock for the Gen 5 like the Gen 4?

 
#10 ·
what model number is the Gen 4 Ohlins TTX?

KA364 for Gen 5 I see you wrote....
[/IMG]
KA364 according to www.ohlins.EU

If it turns out that KA364 uses from factory a spring 95...105, then it is a hint that gen5 link ratio is similar to aftermarket link. In this case I would wait selling your Ohlins (gen4) shock, if it is valved for aftermarket link and you weigth, then just install it on gen5.
If gen5 shock is longer, then just add clevis shim to balance. If it is shorter and gen4 Ohlins will be too long, then Ohlins must be opened and made shorter by adding washers below topout spiring.
 
#13 · (Edited)
Maurice,

The shock you have will fit and work, it will need to be re-valved and re-sprung at a cost of $350.00 including a full service.
The front fork is good, we made some changes and made it really good. Cost to be determined, approximate $500.00
A suspension link is not needed however it definitely makes it better.
Cheers

I got this from Thermosman so I will send in my gen 4 TTX to get fixed for this bike.




So summary is...

2016 stock race links are ok/decent: better than 2011 stock
2011 MSS 4.0 race Links on a 2016 zx10r Is better than stock 2016, but just marginal... I need to send in the 3.5 race link info now...
 
#19 ·
Thank you Vonstallin for posting MSS Gen4 link measurements, this is good info for community.

I agree with LDH that revalving Gen4 Ohlins shock (as shipped by Ohlins) is much needed and if you have already revalved for Kyle link, then you are probably close to optimum.
Kyle link valving for gen4 is much softer compared to stock Ohlins valving, reason is because it's link ratio is 2.15, where stock ratio is 2.4. Difference of 11-12%, logically go down with spring and down with valving.
Now if Ohlins did put 90Nm spring for Gen5 then I speculate that link ratio may be even arround 2.1 (cannot be much higher than that) and Kyle valving will not be soft.
The problem is we don't know exact Gen5 link ratio number yet and how linear it is.

Very intresting and looking forward to know gen5 Ohlins valve spec form LDH and how it compares to Kyle spec.
 
#20 ·
What are Kyle valving or Race links?
I only knew of MSS and Attack Kawasaki Race Links.

Attack Kawasaki Race links should be the exact same measurements as the MSS "4.0" race links. Suburban Rancher purchased all three
MSS 3.5
MSS 4.0
Attack Racing Race links (mss 4.0)

I talk to Adam at MSS and they did make a 3.0 link but I think it was not great so they only made the 3.5 and 4.0.

From what he was telling me the
3.5 are for tighter tracks like what are found in America, while
the 4.0 are more for tracks Moto GP and WSBK would run.

I guess to compare American Track...NJMP vs. COTA
I have no clue, lol just quoting.
 
#23 ·
I compared the Spec Sheets for the KA360 (Gen4) to the KA364 (Gen5) and the only 2 things that really stand out are the way lower start rate on the KA364 using the 90Nm spring for a 160-180lb rider (versus the 110Nm for the Gen 4) and the rebound spec has been reduced one setting. So basically a spring swap and a shim stack change and you can fit an otherwise unadulterated KA340, KA358 or KA360 for the Gen4 bike onto a Gen5 model. Might also have to rearrange the hydraulic adjuster collar and hose to a better positon...

There are a few other small things with spacers, stroke length and topout spring etc, but I don't personally think those particular changes will make much difference in the grand scheme of things for most riders.
 
#29 ·
This is interesting. If the Gen 5 link is similar to the race links for the Gen 4 might be worth a while using stock gen 5 link on the gen 4 for racing.
Being that it is a "stock" link the bike technically would still be eligible to supersport/superstock rules.
 
#31 ·
LDH, you replied to CanyonCarver (about using his gen4 Kyle valved TTX on gen5) that his compression spec is "way higher".
Here www.zx-10r.net/forum/f94/geometry-2016-zx10r-305570-6.html post number #55 says that gen5 link ratio is 2.095.
If this number is true, then there is no significant difference between Kyle 2.15 ratio. Based on this fact, I would say CanyonCarver could be just fine with his (Kyle valved) TTX bolted on gen5 with gen5 stock link.
His shock in gen5 should work the same as in his gen4.
If a spot-on Kyle valving and spring recommendation are way different than Ohlins TTX for gen5, then why did Ohlins go that soft? Did they have street use in mind with factory standard spec?
 
#39 ·
Ladies and Gentlemen!
Thanks to Vonstallin, Gsxrvette and Rafa I think that Gen5 link is roughly "MSS3.9"
One small warning if someone installs it on Gen4: Please measure rear heigth before/after and adjust with shock shim when Gen5 link should change rear heigth.
 
#40 ·
Ladies and Gentlemen!
Thanks to Vonstallin, Gsxrvette and Rafa I think that Gen5 link is roughly "MSS3.9"
One small warning if someone installs it on Gen4: Please measure rear height before/after and adjust with shock shim when Gen5 link should change rear height.
I had someone told me the Gen 5 link was close to the 4.0 MSS links
(that i have for sale in the parts page).
I heard it might be slightly better, but not worth it...and Gen 5 is good enough.
 
#41 ·
I am a cnc programmer. If there is enough demand for a certain size linkage i can make a few sets of them for alot less than mss price. They would be from the same spec alloy and identical sizes. If there is demand let me know. Its no use making 1 set. If you have a batch then price gets cheaper
 
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