Gen 4: 2011-2015 Anyone have some suspension geometry advice - Page 2 - Kawasaki ZX-10R.net
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post #11 of 67 Old 03-03-2017, 04:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evallarta1 View Post
Instead of guessing and speculating, lets just look at REAL numbers for the Gen 4 that I measured about a week ago.

A little about this bike. The suspension is 100% stock and the rider is racing with Pirelli Slick 120/70 and 200/60 slicks. While this affects geometry a bit the numbers won't be too far off from a bike on the showroom floor.



A couple things to notice -

-Trail is around 110mm. This means the front is very stable once in a corner, but entry into corners require more muscle to get in the corners.

- Rake is around 25 degrees, which is pretty good out of the box.

- Swing arm angle (swing arm down slope) is around 12 degrees. This isn't too bad, but add the long trail numbers and the bike has a tendency to drive wide on exit. Especially if the shock is under-sprung and/or heavy throttle is applied.
Oo my God. This is best post of the year.
Evallatra shares valuable insider info what you cannot find in Internet.
This gives solid point of understanding the Gen4 and more.
Many thanks.

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post #12 of 67 Old 03-03-2017, 04:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by evallarta1 View Post
Next ... I add 20mm of ride height (approx 10mm at the shock).
This gives us a swing arm angle of 13.4 which in my opinion is a bit much. It also deletes trail almost 5 mil to 105.9, which again in my opinion is still a bit long.
I go shopping Monday: "A set of those adjustable triple clamp for my Kawasaki please!"
Seriously.

Race Gen4: K-teck DDS, OhlinsGP+link, RCS17+T-Drive, Kit ECU, MivvFull, ported, light crank, race int. cam.
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post #13 of 67 Old 03-03-2017, 04:43 PM
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Originally Posted by 10Arghh View Post
Thanks for detailed response Carlos...Seems you have done a lot of research with this bike.
I only know that I know small fraction what professional people know. Start understanding something and you become aware how much is there that you don't know. I have many questions regarding bike handling to members like Evallatra or LDH, maybe I ask later as thread progresses.

Race Gen4: K-teck DDS, OhlinsGP+link, RCS17+T-Drive, Kit ECU, MivvFull, ported, light crank, race int. cam.
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post #14 of 67 Old 03-03-2017, 06:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Carlos76 View Post
I go shopping Monday: "A set of those adjustable triple clamp for my Kawasaki please!"
Seriously.
Yeah the biggest hurdle is there isn't enough room to drop the front end and not hit hard parts. You can get pretty close on the numbers, but putting on the triples can get things perfect.

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post #15 of 67 Old 03-03-2017, 07:02 PM
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I will have to study this.

I'm dialed in Euro style.
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post #16 of 67 Old 03-03-2017, 08:04 PM
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There is a big problem with the analysis. EV keeps saying the rider will complain about this and that. Since I know the rider, I know he only complains about being old and slow.
evallarta1, mpp12 and Niner1000RR like this.

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post #17 of 67 Old 03-03-2017, 09:26 PM
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thanks for the tutorial EV!

where would one source a 10mm spacer, to add to the rear height?

sounds like the poor mans street bike acceptable set up for turning (think deals gap, or Ozarks type of riding) without buying offset triples, would be a 10mm spacer in the rear shock mount, and to expose 10mm more of the fork tubes?

it appears now approx. 4mm of tube is showing now (stock), are you suggesting 14mm total, or 10mm total fork tube showing?

again, thanks for the info. rep sent your way! Ski

May we all, get to have a chance to ride the fast one, walk away wiser when we crash one, keep hopin that the best one is the last one.
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post #18 of 67 Old 03-04-2017, 01:09 AM
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thanks for the tutorial EV!

where would one source a 10mm spacer, to add to the rear height?

sounds like the poor mans street bike acceptable set up for turning (think deals gap, or Ozarks type of riding) without buying offset triples, would be a 10mm spacer in the rear shock mount, and to expose 10mm more of the fork tubes?

it appears now approx. 4mm of tube is showing now (stock), are you suggesting 14mm total, or 10mm total fork tube showing?

again, thanks for the info. rep sent your way! Ski
Think that Evallatra is not directly suggesting 10mm shim (+20 raise) and droping front too much, but just showing what other numbers those adjustments would affect??
Bike would lift rear wheel easy with changes that much and problems having weight bias.
Offset triples are maybe last toutch to get bike perfect after suspention is well sorted. Do I really NEED them: probably no. Do I WANT them to test out: hell yeah.

Wasn't good member Dricked using aftermarket triples on his race Gen4? Wonder what's was his experience.

Race Gen4: K-teck DDS, OhlinsGP+link, RCS17+T-Drive, Kit ECU, MivvFull, ported, light crank, race int. cam.
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post #19 of 67 Old 03-04-2017, 01:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 10Arghh View Post
Pogo effect reacting to every bump and imperfection..Will try taking out some comp / reb damping.

Also could not get accurate sag setting.

Basically, the springs don't seem to react to weight being applied to them whether preload is taken all the way out or set all the way in.

All the way out, reduces the pogo effect slightly but there is still the damping problem.
...
Anyway, so I think I need stiffer springs although the front feels rock solid and I'm wary of stiffening it further.
Should all be easy fix:

*Pogo. Probably very little rebound damping. There are thin white seals in BPF, when damaged rebound is lost.

*Sag. Forget about sag, Gen4 has long topout springs preventing reaching "old school" sag numbers. Have correct springs for you weight and reasonable preload, then no need to measure sag.

*You wanna stiffer spings? What's you weigth? Are you bottoming or where is zip tie pushed when you do that test?

*Gen4 has compression adjuster and bypass (TEN) affecting both compression and rebound.

Race Gen4: K-teck DDS, OhlinsGP+link, RCS17+T-Drive, Kit ECU, MivvFull, ported, light crank, race int. cam.
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post #20 of 67 Old 03-04-2017, 01:45 AM
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Good thread.
I have something to add. I am 6 foot 4 tall and weight 15 stone which is a bit heavy for fast riding.
However im always quite fast on track but this comes with a few issues for me.
I always have issues with corner exit and always suffer with terrible rear tyre wear on every bike ive had on track.
Mines a gen4 and i found it terribly unstable. Always shaking its head and getting into some odd shapes.
Ive designed the damper valves to replace the motor and its cured the unstable feeling all together and ive lengthened the chain and it might have made a fraction of difference.
Next thing im going to do is fit linier link. Fit a stiffer rear spring and drop the front and raise the rear.
My front wear is absolutely spot on but because the rear is soo bad i am hoping to take a bit if wear off it and transfer it to the front.
I will watch this thread for more info

Last edited by ukzx10r; 03-04-2017 at 01:47 AM.
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