Gen 5: 2016 -> 2016 Superstock Build (WERA Legal) - Page 5 - Kawasaki ZX-10R.net
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post #41 of 50 Old 05-07-2018, 07:48 PM Thread Starter
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Harbor Freight. Itís about $50 I think? Got it years ago.
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post #42 of 50 Old 05-11-2018, 06:41 PM Thread Starter
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So after hours of work in a 90* garage I have come to the conclusion that Kawasaki knows what their doing much more than I do.

There's been a lot of talk about flipping the swing-arm pivot to get a better feeling chassis on corner entry. I can 100% say that the evidence is very strong AGAINST this actually working like everyone might think. I am basing all of this off measurements before and after the flip. The goal was to flip the pivot and then reset the rear geometry to copy the stock REAR geometry but help the front throughout this process.

Now, my measurements are NOT perfect but they work for showing a difference between the two settings. The stock swing-arm angle (with the bikes weight on the shock), was 12.71 degrees. When I flipped the pivot insert AND THEN added 10mm to my KTeck DDS Pro, the angle was 9.5 degrees! The swing-arm was visually flatter and immediately I knew there was going to be a problem if I couldn't get that angle back to the "before" numbers. I continued to add length to the shock but was only able to get it to 9.7 degrees after adding around 15mm to my shock length. Seeing that I still had room on the clevis for adding shims, I stacked some 2mm think washers up to gain an additional 8mm off rear ride height. This brought me up to 10.91 degrees...

Stepping back and looking that the math to make sure I was at least seeing the correct information, I concluded that this cannot be right. Then I realized that I remembered the Kit pivot insert was a "0" and that all the 2017+ machines come with a "0". Maybe there's a reason for this I thought. I can see how adding a zero pivot insert would help but a full 4mm over my current setting is way to far. Hence I moved the setup back to my original numbers and called it a day. Took me about 5 hours but I think it was well worth the time and energy to gain a better understanding of what this bike needs to work properly.

Kit parts will have to be the only way I'll change this bike if I give up on the superstock class.
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"Thereís a moment when a rider needs to stop thinking about technology and just twist the throttle."-Pit Beirer, KTM Motor Sport Director
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post #43 of 50 Old 05-14-2018, 02:02 PM
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Hmm, well you sir are much more thorough than I

I'm going to start my own thread tonight and will post some video but initial thoughts on this past weekend were the bike feels fantastic.

I'm using the stock shock and honestly have no idea if anything was changed on that, I think he just flipped the pivot so my angle had to increase right?

The bike turned in great but was still stable and never felt twitchy. I felt like I could put it wherever I wanted. The only problem that developed is it went from a wheelie machine to a wheelie monster. I haven't touched the suspension in any way aside from setting sag last year and have a stock steering dampner so hopefully TSE can help me keep the front end down for this next weekend of racing.

To also give some input my buddy who won a bunch of Amateur CCS championships last year on a 675r and is now on a 2017 r6 was blown away but how great this bike handled.
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post #44 of 50 Old 05-14-2018, 03:30 PM Thread Starter
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Yeah, I'm not sure why things added up this way, but that's how it went down. For me, the bike steers slow and transitions slow. I've barely had anytime on it so I'll see what happens this weekend at Gratton.

On the exit, the bike is incredible. Very stable and confidence inspiring.

"Thereís a moment when a rider needs to stop thinking about technology and just twist the throttle."-Pit Beirer, KTM Motor Sport Director
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post #45 of 50 Old 05-14-2018, 05:41 PM Thread Starter
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"Thereís a moment when a rider needs to stop thinking about technology and just twist the throttle."-Pit Beirer, KTM Motor Sport Director
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post #46 of 50 Old 05-14-2018, 08:53 PM
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Does WERA not allow the pivot insert or head angle changes in superstock?

So when you flip it did the pivot move higher or lower? I guess I was under the impression it moves higher
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post #47 of 50 Old 05-15-2018, 12:45 AM
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Quote:
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Yeah, I'm not sure why things added up this way, but that's how it went down. For me, the bike steers slow and transitions slow. I've barely had anytime on it so I'll see what happens this weekend at Gratton.



On the exit, the bike is incredible. Very stable and confidence inspiring.


Have you tried lifting the front end? Maybe you have too much weight on the front and the bike is pushing through the corner.


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post #48 of 50 Old 05-15-2018, 05:54 AM Thread Starter
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Does WERA not allow the pivot insert or head angle changes in superstock?

So when you flip it did the pivot move higher or lower? I guess I was under the impression it moves higher
Yes, WERA allows the stock components to be rearranged however you like as long as you don't replace the factory components.

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Have you tried lifting the front end? Maybe you have too much weight on the front and the bike is pushing through the corner.
The front is at stock fork height. My forks are modified and have been interally lengthened by 20mm that's why you can see what looks like a severe "drop" in front ride height. Trust me, the front is at stock levels.

I'll look for this feeling when I'm out on track this weekend. Honestly, I've had no really hard laps on it yet so, I think it best to fully understand the situation before making drastic changes. I think I'll focus on the ergonomics and try to understand the electronics the first morning. By the afternoon, I should have an understanding of whats going on, and can make a step from there.

"Thereís a moment when a rider needs to stop thinking about technology and just twist the throttle."-Pit Beirer, KTM Motor Sport Director
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post #49 of 50 Old 05-15-2018, 06:03 AM
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Yes, WERA allows the stock components to be rearranged however you like as long as you don't replace the factory components.







The front is at stock fork height. My forks are modified and have been interally lengthened by 20mm that's why you can see what looks like a severe "drop" in front ride height. Trust me, the front is at stock levels.



I'll look for this feeling when I'm out on track this weekend. Honestly, I've had no really hard laps on it yet so, I think it best to fully understand the situation before making drastic changes. I think I'll focus on the ergonomics and try to understand the electronics the first morning. By the afternoon, I should have an understanding of whats going on, and can make a step from there.


If u have 20mm of extra travel but are still using full stroke then youíre geometry is not the same as standard when entering a corner and the front is compressed..


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post #50 of 50 Old 05-15-2018, 06:22 AM Thread Starter
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If u have 20mm of extra travel but are still using full stroke then youíre geometry is not the same as standard when entering a corner and the front is compressed..
Very interesting, I did not realize this. I'll admit, I was getting everything out of the stroke length coming off a 170+mph straight at Road Atlanta. Compressing the forks down to about last 20mm or so before the rear wheel would come off the ground. So you're saying that if the front is too low then I'll push into the turn rather than steer the way it needs to? Because of the weight balance that is...

I might take the bike to a local professional geometry shop and get the real numbers of where its at. And at some point, I really want to get rid of these fork internals and get Ohlins or KTech carts. But that's for later in the year.

"Thereís a moment when a rider needs to stop thinking about technology and just twist the throttle."-Pit Beirer, KTM Motor Sport Director
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