hey guys, Im trying to figure out a way to go about to remove the "gentleman's agreement" the 186 mph bar. I know there is a way, but how? anyone done it? anyone know? Please advise, I really wanna find out what can be done on a real 10r with no limiter. thx

http://direct.nikkoracing.com/boutique_us/fiche_produit.cfm?type=2&ref=GP-K166-OV&code_lg=lg_us&pag=1&num=1 anyone try this?? http://direct.nikkoracing.com/boutique_us/images_produits/GP-K166-OV_1.jpg

and how does it take to the PC3?

I think you have to remove the secondary flies on the throttle body. This apparently removes the limitations. Then again you will be restricted by horsepower, gearing & RPM. Not neccessary in that order.

i just wanna unleash the beast fully.. have nothing "legally" holding it back.

I was under the impression that the whole bike was designed around the 300km/hr mark...... at redline, with stock gearing, this bike will do 300 km/hr. I don't think there is a chip you can buy or wires you can cross and BAM your bike will be a lot faster. :dontknow:

i mean, when im at 186, i can still feel it wanting to pull more.. :dontknow:

i mean, when im at 186, i can still feel it wanting to pull more.. :dontknow: Sure it will pull, but not alot more and your speedo will be out anyway, so you are not pulling a true 186. You will need a Green ZX10R to feel the full power of the 10. :lol:

:lol: :lol: yeah.. speedohealer is next on the to do list..

regear it, problem solved

yeah but i like my balls to the wall acceleration :badteeth:

regear it, problem solved Not quite, regear for higher topend, you will need a stronger motor to pull it. Or it will get there but takes forever as it slowly creeps up in speed, by then you have ran out of roads and ended up in the ocean....:lol:

Not quite, regear for higher topend, you will need a stronger motor to pull it. Or it will get there but takes forever as it slowly creeps up in speed, by then you have ran out of roads and ended up in the ocean....:lol: i know i was being factious or sarcastic.

i know i was being factious or sarcastic. Sorry about that man>>. :hello: The real solution would be to use an 04 Black ZX10R that badboy will do 400 clicks no bother....:lol:

yo garth.. hows your built motor on the 1st gen? speed wise, i know you are in FL, how does it feel when gettin on on 429 or 408?

You will feel it pull at 186 with any stock or higher gearing if you disable the rev limiter feature, is this what you are talking about wanting to do? Then you will be able to just rev your engine until it grenades if you want.... but you will be past 186....

You will feel it pull at 186 with any stock or higher gearing if you disable the rev limiter feature, is this what you are talking about wanting to do? Then you will be able to just rev your engine until it grenades if you want.... but you will be past 186.... no disabling rev limiter, that is important!! im talkin bout removing the "gentleman's agreement"

loose body weight or lights items on the bike, more pounds shed will help to increase the top end unless you regear the back sprocket.

loose body weight yeah, this is why i went 1k :lol: im 230 lbs

no disabling rev limiter, that is important!! im talkin bout removing the "gentleman's agreement" OK, that's what we are trying to tell you. There is no such 'thing' to remove from your bike. If you are wanting to go faster than 300Km/hr, the ONLY way to do that is to lower your bikes gearing from stock...go UP in the front and/or DOWN in the back, or get a rear wheel with a larger circumference (which essentially does the same thing). Since you can only turn so many RPMs (engine speed) you HAVE to change your gearing this way to get a greater top end speed. Gearing your bike this way will slow down your acceleration.

:+1: :iamwithst

The stock gearing would be your so called " GENTLE MAN'S AGREEMENT "

The truth, there is a speed limiter, it has nothing to do with gearing or gear position,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, or rpm, its speed sensitive, meaning it sees a mph, and thats it, it will go over that maybe a mph or more depending on how hard and fast you come up on it. I know for certain thats how the second gens are. How to get around it??????????? Well u can figure that one out for yourself:thumbsup:

yo garth.. hows your built motor on the 1st gen? speed wise, i know you are in FL, how does it feel when gettin on on 429 or 408? the bike is haulin ass, have it geared for down low 16/40 right now about 177 on the 13,100 limiter. if you want more mph on stock gearing you can over rev the bike other than that theres nothign you can do other than change your gearing inside the tranny or sprocket wise. I got a vid floating around with my bike on the limiter on radar showing 186mph. the 06-07's I think do 188 with the stock tire/gearing set up. if you anna go faster drop a tooth in the rear, will gain you 3-4 more mph.

damn garth that is a ripin ride you got:thumbsup:

Wrong You need a speedo healer there is a fuction just to do that. the "getto way" is to remove 1 of 3 prongs on the speed sensor. it is located on the front sproket cover. Beware that bolt is week and will break if you he man it back on. My advice get a speedo healer. BTW 1 tooth down in the rea is work 3mph up top. 1 tooth up in the front is worth 10mph up top.

at least casey understands physics

if you want more mph on stock gearing you can over rev the bike other than that theres nothign you can do other than change your gearing inside the tranny or sprocket wise. EXACTLY. You have a SET rpm your engine can turn (with the rev limiter). Your engine is linked to your transmission which has a SET ratio in top gear. That means unless you alter your rev limiter or transmission gear ratio.... your countershaft has a maximum RPM that it will turn. Your countershaft is linked to your rear wheels via a chain and sprockets. The sprockets are EASILY changed and this is how you determine your rear wheel speed at a given engine RPM. If you want a faster top speed than the bike has stock, the only way to do it is 1.) Rev the engine faster than the limiter allows it to turn 2.) Alter your transmission gearing 3.) Add more teeth to the countershaft sprocket 4.) Less teeth on the rear sprocket 5.) Get a rear tire/wheel with a larger outside diameter. That's all you can do on bikes that do not have an electronic speed limiter. I don't know about a second gen. I've heard that some Suzukis are top speed limited electronically as well. Not sure. At least Casey understands physics After Naval Nuclear Power School, internal combustion is not much of a challenge. :wink:

yall are forgetting its not rpm he's running out of. if he's at 5k doing 186 the timing limiter cuts in.sproket gearing aint nothing without power.

Ok so all he really has to do is get a speedo healer and set it crazy so that when he is doning 150 the computer thinks it is doing 100. PLUS 188MPH isnt fast enough for you??

nope! remember im the member going to maxton on this. http://i36.photobucket.com/albums/e19/sczx10r/14sunday.jpg

Well, Its hitting it in the 1/4 mile. I thought everyone thought it didnt have a speed limiter,,,,, I have a gearing issue I have fingered out. I am working through it, yes it hauls ass

I think all he's wanting to do is make it so that the instrument cluster won't stop at the factory 186. True a speedo healer will bring the numbers back down so that there is more room but he's wanting the speedo to be able to read 190 etc...

Wrong You need a speedo healer there is a fuction just to do that. the "getto way" is to remove 1 of 3 prongs on the speed sensor. it is located on the front sproket cover. Beware that bolt is week and will break if you he man it back on. My advice get a speedo healer. BTW 1 tooth down in the rea is work 3mph up top. 1 tooth up in the front is worth 10mph up top. Look, the first gens don't have an electronic speed limiter. Proof of this is that a first gen will pull through to the rev limiter in top gear, which comes in PAST redline. The rev limiter is set at the same rpm in every gear. Look at the electrical schematic. The speed sensor that you are talking about grinding off (:dontknow: ) only has 3 connections. One is power supply FROM the ECU, one is ground, and one is the output signal TO the SPEEDOMETER. That's it. That's all it does. If there was a top speed limiter, then there would be an output signal from the speed sensor back to the ECU, and there IS NOT.

Look, the first gens don't have an electronic speed limiter. Proof of this is that a first gen will pull through to the rev limiter in top gear, which comes in PAST redline. The rev limiter is set at the same rpm in every gear. Look at the electrical schematic. The speed sensor that you are talking about grinding off (:dontknow: ) only has 3 connections. One is power supply FROM the ECU, one is ground, and one is the output signal TO the SPEEDOMETER. That's it. That's all it does. If there was a top speed limiter, then there would be an output signal from the speed sensor back to the ECU, and there IS NOT. So are you saying the ECU has no clue as to what speed the bike is moving at? Just to clarify your statement? JJ

Look, the first gens don't have an electronic speed limiter. Proof of this is that a first gen will pull through to the rev limiter in top gear, which comes in PAST redline. The rev limiter is set at the same rpm in every gear. Look at the electrical schematic. The speed sensor that you are talking about grinding off (:dontknow: ) only has 3 connections. One is power supply FROM the ECU, one is ground, and one is the output signal TO the SPEEDOMETER. That's it. That's all it does. If there was a top speed limiter, then there would be an output signal from the speed sensor back to the ECU, and there IS NOT. Just saying, is it possibe for there to be an output from the speedometer back to the ecu?

Just saying, is it possibe for there to be an output from the speedometer back to the ecu? All I am saying is this, looking at the electrical schematic.... The ECU has a supply voltage line that comes out and splits, one side goes to the speed sensor, the other goes to the speedometer inside the meter. That is a power supply line (blue/yellow). The speed sensor has only one output, and that goes to the speedometer as well (pink). If there is an output from the speedometer, it is not shown on the schematic. The only other wire from the speed sensor is the ground wire. I may be wrong, I'm not swearing on this. Somebody show me on the schematic where the ECU recieves a SPEED input and I will say I am wrong, but I am certainly not seeing it. :dontknow: A speed input would need to either come out of the speedometer or off the speed sensor in conjunction with the gear position indicator somehow, since there is not a DIRECT input back to the ECU. To clarify, I am looking at the diagram for a 2004 USA model ZX-10R.

nope! remember im the member going to maxton on this. That bike is the wallpaper on my desktop. :thumbsup: I want to come watch you run at Maxton, but my wife is dragging me down to SC to visit some friends. Maybe next year.

my bike with stock gearing on the REV limiter at 12,750~ going 186.x mph. My speedo was pinned probably close to mid 6th gear at 189mph as it always does. http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y251/garth285/th_186pass.jpg (http://s7.photobucket.com/albums/y251/garth285/?action=view¤t=186pass.flv)

The truth, there is a speed limiter, it has nothing to do with gearing or gear position,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, or rpm, its speed sensitive, meaning it sees a mph, and thats it, it will go over that maybe a mph or more depending on how hard and fast you come up on it. I know for certain thats how the second gens are. How to get around it??????????? Well u can figure that one out for yourself:thumbsup: I'm talking about a first generation 10R. Second gens may have a speed limiter, I have no idea. Post a wiring diagram and I'm pretty sure I could tell you how to bypass it. I ain't skeered.

my bike with stock gearing on the REV limiter at 12,750~ going 186.x mph. My speedo was pinned probably close to mid 6th gear at 189mph as it always does. DAMN!! You can't even tell what COLOR your bike is a that speed. Must be PB orange to be THAT FAST! Like I said, if it will pull to the rev limiter in 6th gear, with stock gearing, there is no NEED for a speed limiter, so why would KHI even bother to install one?

HAHAHHA you got that right!!!!! the bike went 193 once how it is without the proper tune and should have gone faster but with the improvements I'm going to do weight and aerodynamic-ly wise it should be really rocking!!!! I want to hit 200 on it, its got enough power to do it just have to improve on some things. oh yeah and I've been loosing a lot of weight as well. no sense to have a jockey do it and you cant do it either! lol.

no disabling rev limiter, that is important!! im talkin bout removing the "gentleman's agreement" You guys crack me up. :lol: First of all both Gen 10Rs are limited by the HP in Stock form, gearing changes or not, but not by the “Gentleman’s Agreement” for speeds over 186mph. If you add PCIII, aftermarket exhaust systems, custom maps, a good tail wind etc. you may go over 186mph but you won’t need a SpeedoHealer to achieve that like Busas ZX12s or ZX14s in stock Form :headshake: This subject is OLD try a search some great info. on this subject.:idea: :wink: PS….I believe some said they hit the REV Limiter in 6th Gear in Stock form(meaning no Gear Changes but some add-ons) and the Engine Cuts OUT…BS for me even though I was at 3-4k ft above sea level the bike with 16/40 gearing (first Gen 10R)just hanged around the Rev. limiter and was not going any farther(run was long in the desert) :headshake:…speedohealer top speed recall ….180mph and suspect it was closer to 176mph and the bike just stopped accelerating..no more speed advances with 156hp and would NOT HIT THE REV. LIMITER in TOP GEAR :headshake :badteeth: bloo

You guys crack me up. :lol: First of all both Gen 10Rs are limited by the HP in Stock form, gearing changes or not, but not by the “Gentleman’s Agreement” for speeds over 186mph. If you add PCIII, aftermarket exhaust systems, custom maps, a good tail wind etc. you may go over 186mph but you won’t need a SpeedoHealer to achieve that like Busas ZX12s or ZX14s in stock Form :headshake: This subject is OLD try a search some great info. on this subject.:idea: :wink: You will not go over 186 mph on stock gearing. Period. Garth just proved that in the vid he posted. He has about 175 rwhp and the bike does 186 pegged on the limiter. PS….I believe some said they hit the REV Limiter in 6th Gear in Stock form(meaning no Gear Changes but some add-ons) and the Engine Cuts OUT…BS for me That's what a rev limiter is supposed to do, right? even though I was at 3-4k ft above sea level the bike with 16/40 gearing (first Gen 10R)just hanged around the Rev. limiter and was not going any farther(run was long in the desert) :headshake:…speedohealer top speed recall ….180mph and suspect it was closer to 176mph and the bike just stopped accelerating..no more speed advances with 156hp and would NOT HIT THE REV. LIMITER in TOP GEAR :headshake :badteeth: bloo Maybe you had a headwind, it's hard to tell at that speed. Did you run it to redline in every gear or did you just roll on in 6th gear? Dirty air filter or fuel filter? LOTS of things can stop a bike from hitting the rev limiter in top gear. Not sure where you are going with this one. There are lots of people with almost stock engines that have hit the rev limiter in top gear.

You will not go over 186 mph on stock gearing. Period. Garth just proved that in the vid he posted. He has about 175 rwhp and the bike does 186 pegged on the limiter. That's what a rev limiter is supposed to do, right? Maybe you had a headwind, it's hard to tell at that speed. Did you run it to redline in every gear or did you just roll on in 6th gear? Dirty air filter or fuel filter? LOTS of things can stop a bike from hitting the rev limiter in top gear. Not sure where you are going with this one. There are lots of people with almost stock engines that have hit the rev limiter in top gear. First of all learn to read carefully, that's exactly what I was suggesting and no Garth didn't prove anything as his mods are to abstract to as they change all the time to call it close. :badteeth: As far as members hitting the Rev. limiter in Top Gear I am talking about Stock and do they have it in GPS and are their Mods verified :heyyou: for example we had a few members showing 188mph + on this site with GPS but Gearing and Mods can never be verified only their word. The Gentlemans Agreement is for bikes that have the HP that will easily do over 186mph but are restricted from factory. Most 1000cc bikes don't need to be restricted to limit them to 186mph because HP and design/Aeros takes care of that. :wink:

in stock form depending on the rider (one of the biggest factors) you can hit the limiter on these bikes no problem. A fatass like me needs to pump the bike full of goodies to make it do it but they will do it the 04-05's will do 186 and the 06-07's will do 188 a simple gearing calculator will tell you it works out like that and thats what it will actually do on the street. I think I did that video cause someone wanted to know what the bikes were limited to and that was stock gearing stock size tire and stock limiter so the physical RPM's the crank turns the tranny turns the sprockets turns the tire will not allow the bike to go any faster than that. anyways no one cares.... .the bikes arent speed limited well the zx10's aint so kinda doesnt matter. theres to much BS on this site enough as is with NEWB questions and repeated "USE THE SEARCH BUTTON" for me to bother with it lol. Im jsut focused on makin my bike go over 200! lol

in stock form depending on the rider (one of the biggest factors) you can hit the limiter on these bikes no problem. A fatass like me needs to pump the bike full of goodies to make it do it but they will do it the 04-05's will do 186 and the 06-07's will do 188 a simple gearing calculator will tell you it works out like that and thats what it will actually do on the street. I think I did that video cause someone wanted to know what the bikes were limited to and that was stock gearing stock size tire and stock limiter so the physical RPM's the crank turns the tranny turns the sprockets turns the tire will not allow the bike to go any faster than that. anyways no one cares.... .the bikes arent speed limited well the zx10's aint so kinda doesnt matter. theres to much BS on this site enough as is with NEWB questions and repeated "USE THE SEARCH BUTTON" for me to bother with it lol. Im jsut focused on makin my bike go over 200! lol Judging by your history I don't think you ever ran a 10R is stock Form..lol Not one World Wide test, Magazine or Manufacturer has ever achieved or stated the 1000cc bikes will do over 186mph in stock form on a consistent basis or ever archived that...and from my 2 yrs + on this site I haven't seen it done consistantly either in stock form. Anyway good way to save face " Garth... the bikes aren't speed limited well the zx10's ain't so kinda doesn't matter" :occasion1 and that's all I was trying to tell all in this thread and if you do hit the Rev. Limiter in top Gear with stock gearing show that vid with NO MODS. :idea: :wink: bloo

Judging by your history I don't think you ever ran a 10R is stock Form..lol TUSHAY!!!! hahahha yeah im a whole different story, we'll have to find someone with a stock bike and a jockey and we'll see what happens.

Here's some "on the dyno info you guys want.... At dyno werks they test in 5th gear. well they couldnt tune my top end because there was this weird spike of lean. i walked in as they were discussing it. I told them that was the gov, kicking in. so they down shifted to 4th and ran it and Walla! full map. the spike hit at 186mph. Make sence?

Here's some "on the dyno info you guys want.... At dyno werks they test in 5th gear. well they couldnt tune my top end because there was this weird spike of lean. i walked in as they were discussing it. I told them that was the gov, kicking in. so they down shifted to 4th and ran it and Walla! full map. the spike hit at 186mph. Make sence? Stock gearing? If so then yes it makes sense because at 186 you are on the rev limiter.

Here's some "on the dyno info you guys want.... At dyno werks they test in 5th gear. well they couldnt tune my top end because there was this weird spike of lean. i walked in as they were discussing it. I told them that was the gov, kicking in. so they down shifted to 4th and ran it and Walla! full map. the spike hit at 186mph. Make sence? On second thought, no this doesn't make sense (to me anyways.) What bike are you on that will do 186 mph at the top of 5th gear??

turbo zx14.... the zx14 can hit the speed limmiter in stock form in 5th... one of there big addvertizing gimmics too. thats why we built the bike we did. because the bike can hit 186 in 5th but theres not one in the 200mph club. ironic huh? everyone was just missing parts. we have 2 zx14's and more spare parts than most people have on there bikes!

Okay, I had a feeling you were going to say that.:lol: That's where some of the confusion lies, you are talking about a turbo ZX-14 and I am talking about a first generation ZX-10R. Good luck at Maxton, brother. I hope you do really well. :thumbsup:

Some one once told me that the old skool Back-in-the-day Busa would do over 200mph and that the new one can trip it once but after that they are restricted to a lower speed?

I dont care how fast my 06 10 does really, i know its got 174.72 bhp at the rear wheel, i have taken it to 189mph (indicated by the clocks), uk spec bike, and i havent had any one pass me yet, so as for top end, untill some one passes me and i dont get the rush anymore, then i dont care lmfao, i know she flys, and she will power wheelie at 135mph+ (i dont do them but she will do if wanted and have done once or twice) they all fly, 200mph, not really that inportant an issue is it??? .

I dont care how fast my 06 10 does really, i know its got 174.72 bhp at the rear wheel, i have taken it to 189mph (indicated by the clocks), uk spec bike, and i havent had any one pass me yet, so as for top end, untill some one passes me and i dont get the rush anymore, then i dont care lmfao, i know she flys, and she will power wheelie at 135mph+ (i dont do them but she will do if wanted and have done once or twice) they all fly, 200mph, not really that inportant an issue is it??? . I went out this weekend and verified my 06's speedo accuracy with a GPS. It is +6% optomistic, with stock gearing ad new rear tire, so a 189 indicated is actually about 178 MPH in real world. Just FYI JJ

oh wait 04-05 or 06-07?

Casey, without looking I think you're right that the ecu does not get the speed signal from the front sprocket. However, it doesn't necessarily need it. If it knows the RPM and gear position, thats all it needs to figure speed. The flip side to this is what you also said - change sprockets or tire diameter to fool this.

Well...my suggestion which worked very well for me was to ...Fart in yer fuel tank after you have eaten a large bowl of cabbage and home made beans.. My 10 did 4 runs up the road at a continous 204.675737282 mph..Better yet..i can even prove it ...I used the crayons from my kids color book and wrote it on my shield..so there...disprove that!!!!!!! FFS,who cares if yer bike can do 186 stock ot faster non stock...How often and for what purpose are ya gonna use it..Cops aint gonna chase ya at that speed,chopper aint gonna catch ya and god forbid theres a turn in the road... They were built just with the brute power feelin of haven the shit pulled from yer ass b4 ya drop yer pants...You can get that from 186 and down..